Transfer Portal '23-'24 Offseason

[Reggie Redbird]

Bummer for UNI - and what all FCS schools, especially Valley schools are afraid of - Big Ten poaching good players, with NIL (TV) money.

Just for clarification, are you saying that the TV deals give the schools money to offset when boosters route their money directly to players instead of donating it to the football program?

TV money gives these programs amazing resources, but that money isn’t used to pay players beyond scholarships/“cost of attendance” money. Ohio State, Michigan, Alabama, Georgia, Texas, etc aren’t shelling out 6-7 figures for players themselves.

 

[fourthandshort]

You would rather have players leave and not take the 300,000 payout..gotcha.

With regard to uneven playing field regarding the transfer portal and NIL, you have a point there. But aside from that, no ... I would rather compete in MVFC than trade places with a Georgia St like scenario allegedly earning a playoff bid. The $300k payday is just 1 line/factor on that FBS P&L decision .. right ?

For starters, add 20 more schollies. Then add stadium upgrades. Then add new travel budget. Then add all the higher FBS salaries and staffing requirements for coaches and admin. And most recently add the new $5 million ante ... admittedly brand new factor which we would have avoided if we anted up a few months earlier.

And aside from all that, there is still the question of whether or not we have what it takes to be successful at next level. Fans, donors, plus our Admin is more conservative and even-handed when it comes to all their sports teams handling/budgeting. Lot of headwinds ... notiong that this is easy decision doesn't make sense .. it is a tough decision, even before they upped the ante to 5 million.

 

[crazzymark]

Naming rites for the football stadium, 20 more 2,3or 4 star rated players. The ISU coaching is at or above some MAC and SUN conferences schools. We will see if that fee sticks or not. Some schools are taking legal action against the NCAA so they can move up.

 

[fourthandshort]

Naming rites for the football stadium, 20 more 2,3or 4 star rated players. The ISU coaching is at or above some MAC and SUN conferences schools. We will see if that fee sticks or not. Some schools are taking legal action against the NCAA so they can move up.

you mean like how we did so well with our IPF fund raising and budget ???

The fee change is almost comical ... 5k to 5m .. with about 3 months notice.

 

[Reggie Redbird]

With regard to uneven playing field regarding the transfer portal and NIL, you have a point there. But aside from that, no ... I would rather compete in MVFC than trade places with a Georgia St like scenario allegedly earning a playoff bid. The $300k payday is just 1 line/factor on that FBS P&L decision .. right ?

For starters, add 20 more schollies. Then add stadium upgrades. Then add new travel budget. Then add all the higher FBS salaries and staffing requirements for coaches and admin. And most recently add the new $5 million ante ... admittedly brand new factor which we would have avoided if we anted up a few months earlier.

And aside from all that, there is still the question of whether or not we have what it takes to be successful at next level. Fans, donors, plus our Admin is more conservative and even-handed when it comes to all their sports teams handling/budgeting. Lot of headwinds ... notiong that this is easy decision doesn't make sense .. it is a tough decision, even before they upped the ante to 5 million.

To fully fund, it’s also the offsetting spend on scholarships and other expenses from a Title 9 perspective, unless we’re cutting 2-3 other men’s sports.

 

[Redbird28]

Would be interesting to see how much we even made when we went to the FCS Championship? We were on the road the entire time ti seems. I'd easily make a road trip to Oxford OHI to watch us play Miami of Ohio than to drive out to Brookings SD or even Cedar Falls (UNI) . As for a bowl, yes to me a bowl victory over a fellow FBS team in Mobile AL trumps winning an FCS Championship (which is like a JV Tourney of Football). Sorry to the FCS lowers of Stony Brook, EIU, etc. Look for Montana, SD State, SD, ND, NDakota State, Idaho and others to jump to FBS. But hey we'll still get to play in front of 3000 in Terre Haute

With the exception of swag bags for the players, the current bowl games are meaningless, and that's why we are seeing more and more players sit out rather than expose themselves to injury in a meaningless game. From a coaches perspective they used to mean a lot just because they got 15 additional practices, but now even that means nothing because every single player that wants can just go into the portal and chase the most NIL money and playing time that any given program is willing to offer thus negating the advantages of those practices in the systems in their current schools.

I don't blame the players a bit. If the coaches can chase paper then the kids should be able to as well.

I also don't waste my time trying to find a tv to watch any particular bowl game. The only games that matter in FBS now are the playoff games, and it's not even a real playoff at this point. They need to expand the field and use the existing bowl sites as locations to play those the expanded bracket games. Then those "bowl" games will actually be worth watching.

 

[ChiRedbirdfan]

To fully fund, it’s also the offsetting spend on scholarships and other expenses from a Title 9 perspective, unless we’re cutting 2-3 other men’s sports.

to that topic...why is isu not cutting some sports where possible and making strategic changes?...absolutely mind-boggling as we are a perfect candidate for change...sports elimination is happening everywhere in ncaa div 1 including power 5 programs. isu fans bitch and complain about the game experience being poor, attendance being poor, fan apathy, weak home scheduling...etc and "wanting to go back to the old way". the problem is the old way is long gone and peeps fail to realize that or accept it. there is no going back as the landscape is vastly different from the past including fan preferences, tv/streaming revenue, transfer rules, nil, conference alignment, sponsorships/naming rights. unless some strategic changes are made peeps better suck it up and accept where isu sports is...as well as accept the continued ongoing gradual erosion of the entire athletic program.

 

[MadBird]

to that topic...why is isu not cutting some sports where possible and making strategic changes?...absolutely mind-boggling as we are a perfect candidate for change...sports elimination is happening everywhere in ncaa div 1 including power 5 programs. isu fans bitch and complain about the game experience being poor, attendance being poor, fan apathy, weak home scheduling...etc and "wanting to go back to the old way". the problem is the old way is long gone and peeps fail to realize that or accept it. there is no going back as the landscape is vastly different from the past including fan preferences, tv/streaming revenue, transfer rules, nil, conference alignment, sponsorships/naming rights. unless some strategic changes are made peeps better suck it up and accept where isu sports is...as well as accept the continued ongoing gradual erosion of the entire athletic program.

I know its probably futile to post "facts" in this discussion, minds are already made up, opinions are considered facts by many folks, but I offer this regarding the "erosion" of the athletic program.

Illinois State has earned its fourth-straight Missouri Valley Conference All-Sports Championship, the Conference has announced today. The Redbirds won the league’s All-Sports Trophy in 2018-19, 2020-21, 2021-22, and 2022-23 (the Conference did not award the trophy during the 2019-20 pandemic-shortened season.)

Illinois State Earns 2022-23 MVC All-Sports Trophy

ST. LOUIS, MO. -- Illinois State has earned its fourth-straight Missouri Valley Conference All-Sports Championship, the Conference has announced today.

mvc-sports.com

 

[Dmills]

 

[RedbirdSoxFan]

Would be interesting to see how much we even made when we went to the FCS Championship? We were on the road the entire time ti seems. I'd easily make a road trip to Oxford OHI to watch us play Miami of Ohio than to drive out to Brookings SD or even Cedar Falls (UNI) . As for a bowl, yes to me a bowl victory over a fellow FBS team in Mobile AL trumps winning an FCS Championship (which is like a JV Tourney of Football). Sorry to the FCS lowers of Stony Brook, EIU, etc. Look for Montana, SD State, SD, ND, NDakota State, Idaho and others to jump to FBS. But hey we'll still get to play in front of 3000 in Terre Haute

I made the drive to Frisco to watch the Redbirds play for the FCS National Championship. Although the Redbirds did not win, I would do it again. However, there is Zero chance that if Illinois State were in the MAC that I would drive to Tucson, Arizona to watch the Redbirds play Wyoming in the (meaningless) Arizona Bowl. But that’s just me!

 

[Virginia Redbird]

I know its probably futile to post "facts" in this discussion, minds are already made up, opinions are considered facts by many folks, but I offer this regarding the "erosion" of the athletic program.

MadBird, you made me laugh out loud. To quote one of my favorite authors Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, "there is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact."

 

[ISUBU]

to that topic...why is isu not cutting some sports where possible and making strategic changes?...absolutely mind-boggling as we are a perfect candidate for change...sports elimination is happening everywhere in ncaa div 1 including power 5 programs. isu fans bitch and complain about the game experience being poor, attendance being poor, fan apathy, weak home scheduling...etc and "wanting to go back to the old way". the problem is the old way is long gone and peeps fail to realize that or accept it. there is no going back as the landscape is vastly different from the past including fan preferences, tv/streaming revenue, transfer rules, nil, conference alignment, sponsorships/naming rights. unless some strategic changes are made peeps better suck it up and accept where isu sports is...as well as accept the continued ongoing gradual erosion of the entire athletic program.

The Division I schools that are cutting sports are doing to to approach the model ISU already follows. We have one more than the minimum required number of men's sports, and since Cross Country and Track count as two sports even with many double athletes, I don't see much room for any "strategic" changes if you mean pulling funding from a men's team to better fund football and/or basketball.

ChiRedbirdfan is correct that the landscape is vastly different. I would have never guessed that the Big 10 with UCLA and USC would not also want Stanford or Cal. This only makes sense to me in one way: ESPN and entertainment money is making the decisions and not the presidents. The networks already have their finger on the scale when making bowl assignments or NCAA basketball selections. For what other reason do the big name dregs get preferential treatment over better teams with smaller footprints (see the new NIT selection standards)?

We need to find a way to build our fanbase in a way that grows our revenues. Eyeballs watching televisions or internet, and butts paying for seats.

 

[topiarydan]

I made the drive to Frisco to watch the Redbirds play for the FCS National Championship. Although the Redbirds did not win, I would do it again. However, there is Zero chance that if Illinois State were in the MAC that I would drive to Tucson, Arizona to watch the Redbirds play Wyoming in the (meaningless) Arizona Bowl. But that’s just me!

So you went to Frisco - that's great - but did you drive to New Hampshire or Eastern Washington? Who would you rather see at Hancock during our 6 home games? (EIU, N Dakota, YSU, Indy State, SDakota, Lindenwood) or (Tulsa, Memphis, Northern Illinois, Western Ky, Ball State and SIU)?

 

[ChiRedbirdfan]

I know its probably futile to post "facts" in this discussion, minds are already made up, opinions are considered facts by many folks, but I offer this regarding the "erosion" of the athletic program.

Illinois State Earns 2022-23 MVC All-Sports Trophy

ST. LOUIS, MO. -- Illinois State has earned its fourth-straight Missouri Valley Conference All-Sports Championship, the Conference has announced today.

mvc-sports.com

LOGICAL FALLACY!.....you trying to make me laugh Madbird?....seriously ask the mighty Stanford Cardinals how desired their athletic program was/is despite absolutely dominating the Directors cup.... NACDA Directors' Cup - Wikipedia . further ISU athletics now resides in a watered down mvc conference via a long standing mvc tradition of attrition of members at the top of the conference and addition of new members at the bottom. plus other current mvc athletic departments (other than mo state) likely do not put the resources forward and/or do not have the resources to meaningfully put forward to compete with isu for that much sought after "mvc all sports trophy".... this mvc all sports trophy is damn close to being a participation trophy in terms of value. if the mvc all sports trophy is how the ISU athletic department measures its success then the future looks bleak esp as respects to football and men's basketball and the erosion will continue.

 

[fourthandshort]

LOGICAL FALLACY!.....you trying to make me laugh Madbird?....seriously ask the mighty Stanford Cardinals how desired their athletic program was/is despite absolutely dominating the Directors cup.... NACDA Directors' Cup - Wikipedia . further ISU athletics now resides in a watered down mvc conference via a long standing mvc tradition of attrition of members at the top of the conference and addition of new members at the bottom. plus other current mvc athletic departments (other than mo state) likely do not put the resources forward and/or do not have the resources to meaningfully put forward to compete with isu for that much sought after "mvc all sports trophy".... this mvc all sports trophy is damn close to being a participation trophy in terms of value. if the mvc all sports trophy is how the ISU athletic department measures its success then the future looks bleak esp as respects to football and men's basketball and the erosion will continue.

I get your fundamental point, basketball has really slipped the last decade, and football has slipped since 2019. Beyond that, you seem to be grasping at straws to make this sound as bad as you can.

So below is Sagarin's current Basketball Conference rankings, and it admittedly has slipped since the Wichita St/Creighton era. But it still ranks 12th of 32 D-I conferences. And yes, our basketball program should be competing at higher level. As well our our football should be making playoffs more often than it has since 2019. But you seem to want to paint the bleakest picture you paint it like this: "as well as accept the continued ongoing gradual erosion of the entire athletic program."

Are you predicting the basketball program is already dragging down the rest of the non-football sports ? or about to start dragging it down ? Football has never been better the last decade, though slipped of late playing in the SEC of FCS. So clearly the football program has never dragged down the other programs. ISU is financially secure, and admittedly spreads the sports resources more evenly than other peer schools.

Found this recent blurb after we won 22-23: Illinois State has 16 all-sports crowns and has finished first, second, or third in 29 of the past 32 years. So neither football nor basketball has seemingly affected the other sports having won 5 of last 6, 16 of 32, and been 2nd or 3rd 13 other times. Only 3 times in 32 years have we finished 4th or worse.

Like it or not, ISU does really well compared to it's peer schools, no matter how youtry to spin it .. though noted you dialed it down to basketball and football woes only in your follow up post. But you and others still paint with a broad brush, no matter what the facts says to contrary. I know many here would argue, we should have stronger peer group ... except for fact that we don't and have never, and it's is just NOT a sports program in decline. Other schools would roll their eyes at this self loathing.

1 BIG 12 = 85.53 85.69 ( 1) 10 85.67 ( 1)
2 BIG TEN = 84.05 83.49 ( 2) 14 83.65 ( 2)
3 BIG EAST = 82.64 82.45 ( 3) 11 82.53 ( 3)
4 SOUTHEASTERN = 82.15 81.90 ( 4) 14 81.99 ( 4)
5 PAC-12 = 80.73 80.54 ( 5) 12 80.67 ( 5)
6 ATLANTIC COAST = 79.99 79.69 ( 6) 15 79.80 ( 6)
7 AMER. ATHLETIC = 77.65 77.90 ( 7) 11 77.81 ( 7)
8 MOUNTAIN WEST = 77.30 77.61 ( 8) 11 77.51 ( 8)
9 WEST COAST = 76.47 76.96 ( 9) 10 76.70 ( 9)
10 CONFERENCE USA = 74.22 74.75 ( 10) 11 74.53 ( 10)
11 ATLANTIC 10 = 73.77 74.19 ( 11) 15 74.07 ( 11)
12 MISSOURI VALLEY = 72.41 72.12 ( 13) 12 72.26 ( 12)
13 IVY LEAGUE = 72.38 72.05 ( 14) 8 72.26 ( 13)
14 WESTERN ATHLETIC = 72.03 72.22 ( 12) 13 72.18 ( 14)
15 SUN BELT = 71.62 71.52 ( 15) 14 71.55 ( 15)
16 BIG WEST = 70.46 70.03 ( 18) 11 70.15 ( 18)
17 SOUTHERN = 70.41 70.21 ( 17) 10 70.33 ( 17)
18 MAC = 70.35 70.76 ( 16) 12 70.60 ( 16)
19 BIG SKY = 68.82 68.90 ( 19) 10 68.88 ( 19)
20 HORIZON = 68.26 67.57 ( 24) 11 67.91 ( 23)
21 ATLANTIC SUN = 68.18 68.39 ( 20) 14 68.30 ( 20)
22 BIG SOUTH = 67.90 67.57 ( 25) 10 67.64 ( 24)
23 METRO ATLANTIC = 67.53 68.22 ( 22) 11 68.00 ( 21)
24 COLONIAL = 67.49 68.33 ( 21) 13 68.00 ( 22)
25 SUMMIT LEAGUE = 67.06 67.78 ( 23) 10 67.50 ( 25)
26 AMERICA EAST = 66.84 67.37 ( 26) 9 67.18 ( 26)
27 PATRIOT = 66.41 66.77 ( 27) 10 66.64 ( 27)
28 OHIO VALLEY = 63.95 63.79 ( 28) 10 63.82 ( 28)
29 MEAC = 63.63 63.59 ( 29) 8 63.60 ( 29)
30 SOUTHWESTERN = 62.26 62.26 ( 31) 12 62.24 ( 31)
31 SOUTHLAND = 62.22 62.53 ( 30) 10 62.44 ( 30)
32 NORTHEAST = 61.93 61.63 ( 32) 9 61.75 ( 32)

 

[RedbirdSoxFan]

I made the drive to Frisco to watch the Redbirds play for the FCS National Championship. Although the Redbirds did not win, I would do it again. However, there is Zero chance that if Illinois State were in the MAC that I would drive to Tucson, Arizona to watch the Redbirds play Wyoming in the (meaningless) Arizona Bowl. But that’s just me!

I might add that I would drive to Tucson to watch Illinois State play Wyoming in the Arizona Bowl IF Sargent Hulka would promise to allow me to sleep under his carport for the duration of my stay in Tucson.

 

[MadBird]

I get your fundamental point, basketball has really slipped the last decade, and football has slipped since 2019. Beyond that, you seem to be grasping at straws to make this sound as bad as you can.

So below is Sagarin's current Basketball Conference rankings, and it admittedly has slipped since the Wichita St/Creighton era. But it still ranks 12th of 32 D-I conferences. And yes, our basketball program should be competing at higher level. As well our our football should be making playoffs more often than it has since 2019. But you seem to want to paint the bleakest picture you paint it like this: "as well as accept the continued ongoing gradual erosion of the entire athletic program."

Are you predicting the basketball program is already dragging down the rest of the non-football sports ? or about to start dragging it down ? Football has never been better the last decade, though slipped of late playing in the SEC of FCS. So clearly the football program has never dragged down the other programs. ISU is financially secure, and admittedly spreads the sports resources more evenly than other peer schools.

Found this recent blurb after we won 22-23: Illinois State has 16 all-sports crowns and has finished first, second, or third in 29 of the past 32 years. So neither football nor basketball has seemingly affected the other sports having won 5 of last 6, 16 of 32, and been 2nd or 3rd 13 other times. Only 3 times in 32 years have we finished 4th or worse.

Like it or not, ISU does really well compared to it's peer schools, no matter how youtry to spin it .. though noted you dialed it down to basketball and football woes only in your follow up post. But you and others still paint with a broad brush, no matter what the facts says to contrary. I know many here would argue, we should have stronger peer group ... except for fact that we don't and have never, and it's is just NOT a sports program in decline. Other schools would roll their eyes at this self loathing.

1 BIG 12 = 85.53 85.69 ( 1) 10 85.67 ( 1)
2 BIG TEN = 84.05 83.49 ( 2) 14 83.65 ( 2)
3 BIG EAST = 82.64 82.45 ( 3) 11 82.53 ( 3)
4 SOUTHEASTERN = 82.15 81.90 ( 4) 14 81.99 ( 4)
5 PAC-12 = 80.73 80.54 ( 5) 12 80.67 ( 5)
6 ATLANTIC COAST = 79.99 79.69 ( 6) 15 79.80 ( 6)
7 AMER. ATHLETIC = 77.65 77.90 ( 7) 11 77.81 ( 7)
8 MOUNTAIN WEST = 77.30 77.61 ( 8) 11 77.51 ( 8)
9 WEST COAST = 76.47 76.96 ( 9) 10 76.70 ( 9)
10 CONFERENCE USA = 74.22 74.75 ( 10) 11 74.53 ( 10)
11 ATLANTIC 10 = 73.77 74.19 ( 11) 15 74.07 ( 11)
12 MISSOURI VALLEY = 72.41 72.12 ( 13) 12 72.26 ( 12)
13 IVY LEAGUE = 72.38 72.05 ( 14) 8 72.26 ( 13)
14 WESTERN ATHLETIC = 72.03 72.22 ( 12) 13 72.18 ( 14)
15 SUN BELT = 71.62 71.52 ( 15) 14 71.55 ( 15)
16 BIG WEST = 70.46 70.03 ( 18) 11 70.15 ( 18)
17 SOUTHERN = 70.41 70.21 ( 17) 10 70.33 ( 17)
18 MAC = 70.35 70.76 ( 16) 12 70.60 ( 16)
19 BIG SKY = 68.82 68.90 ( 19) 10 68.88 ( 19)
20 HORIZON = 68.26 67.57 ( 24) 11 67.91 ( 23)
21 ATLANTIC SUN = 68.18 68.39 ( 20) 14 68.30 ( 20)
22 BIG SOUTH = 67.90 67.57 ( 25) 10 67.64 ( 24)
23 METRO ATLANTIC = 67.53 68.22 ( 22) 11 68.00 ( 21)
24 COLONIAL = 67.49 68.33 ( 21) 13 68.00 ( 22)
25 SUMMIT LEAGUE = 67.06 67.78 ( 23) 10 67.50 ( 25)
26 AMERICA EAST = 66.84 67.37 ( 26) 9 67.18 ( 26)
27 PATRIOT = 66.41 66.77 ( 27) 10 66.64 ( 27)
28 OHIO VALLEY = 63.95 63.79 ( 28) 10 63.82 ( 28)
29 MEAC = 63.63 63.59 ( 29) 8 63.60 ( 29)
30 SOUTHWESTERN = 62.26 62.26 ( 31) 12 62.24 ( 31)
31 SOUTHLAND = 62.22 62.53 ( 30) 10 62.44 ( 30)
32 NORTHEAST = 61.93 61.63 ( 32) 9 61.75 ( 32)

Thanks fourth, I was just gonna drop it.

 

[MadBird]

I made the trip to Frisco, and would prolly do it again. I'd hit a bowl game depending on where - definitely would consider Tucson, good town I've been to several times. El Paso/Sun Bowl would be cool. Nashville. I've had good times in Montgomery and Birmingham too. Something in the Carolinas. Famous Idaho Potato Bowl, not so much!

 

[RedbirdSoxFan]

So you went to Frisco - that's great - but did you drive to New Hampshire or Eastern Washington? Who would you rather see at Hancock during our 6 home games? (EIU, N Dakota, YSU, Indy State, SDakota, Lindenwood) or (Tulsa, Memphis, Northern Illinois, Western Ky, Ball State and SIU)?

How many Redbird fans that attended the game in Frisco attended the game’s in New Hampshire or Eastern Washington? Did you attend the game’s in Frisco, Cheney, and Durham?
The game in Frisco was for a National Championship. To get to that game Illinois State needed to beat Northern Iowa, win at Eastern Washington, and win at New Hampshire. Toledo need only to win the MAC-West and lose to Miami-Ohio in the MAC championship game.
I might guess that outside of Reno and those in Toledo who actually follow the University of Toledo (over Ohio State) could even name the participants in the Arizona Bowl.

 

[Virginia Redbird]

If you've not been to a bowl game, they are fun times. Even the lower tier bowls. I have been to a few. The Rose Bowl (back in the late 70's when I lived in LA and it was really "The Grandaddy of them all" as Keith Jackson used to say! All the way to the Motor City Bowl at the old Silverdome when I lived outside Detroit. I had a great time at all of them. I can plan for one game around work and family but travelling to several playoff games just is not going to happen. The location of the bowl can make it a great trip as well. Not always, say like in Detroit but some nice places. Yep, for just one game in Tucson...I am in. I would make a trip to Tucson for a bowl game probably before I would travel to Fargo in December for a real FCS playoff game. I lived in Illinois for a couple decades and have already seen snow. Just my personal outlook but none of it matters. ISU is not going to leave FCS.