Spoiled - Let's Start Again

[Redbirdwarrior]

I think expecting a big turnaround this year is unfair/unrealistic. But with the portal now it’s not a 5 yr plan if your any good. Look at our opponents tonight, they still stunk last year, and we knocked them out of the MVC tour. But in year 2 they look pretty good. No way it should take 5 years in the current environment.

Three years minimum. Five on the high side and, honestly, five is probably more likely for a low/mid major than others because of the new portal rules where players are all essentially playing on one-year contracts with opt outs every season and seemingly endless eligibility (Remember when we made fun of Zach Lofton when he started at New Mexico State, his 5th college, at age 23? This is somehow becoming commonplace).

We have not even gotten to the point where the portal torpedos team growth and success, but as coach starts developing 1-2 star players into 15-20 PPG players, schools with bigger pedigrees and deeper NIL pockets are going to swoop in and take what they want.

All that to say is Coach took this job knowing it would be a challenge and knew it would take years (more than 2) to even start seeing any kind of advancement of the program on the court. You all were calling for Mullers head because you all wanted to tear it down. Guys, this is what torn down looks like. If not for the huge success that was the Horton game, this season would look like one of the very worst in school history. But it isn't. You had to tear down to build a foundation and Coach is doing just that. Would we prefer a foundation of 3 star recruits and 20 win seasons? Of course, but it isn't realistic. As many of us said during the "FIRE MULLER" debates, you are ASKING for 2-3 seasons of under 10 total wins. This is exactly what was expected by anyone with any logic.

 

[Adunk33]

"We're definetly a work in progress. We're trying to build daily the program that we want to build here. It's a process. As frusturating as it can be it takes some time and we've got to continue to learn and grow and improve. Day by day and game by game and that's really where my mindset remains.

"We're building here. We're trying to build something very special and the reality is; it's not going to come over night. I don't think anyone thinks it will. They shouldn't. You've got to earn your keep. We've gotta continue to build with the players that are here and continue to build with our roster. What we're building here, I don't don't doubt that (players staying positive) or the players' care factor at all. We are going to have to face adversity and have mental and physical toughness through this grind."

-Ryan Pedon 1/4/23.

 

[redbirds2000]

Did you guys think coach was going to come in and we were suddenly going to win 20 games? Hell no. A new coaching staff in college basketball, like it or not, is a 3-5 year process of turning a ship most times. You have to re-establish a culture, recruit your players to fit your scheme then develop those players. Takes a good long time.
That said, we knew this would happen when we got rid of Muller. You would give up mediocrity and 6th-8th place finishes and gamble 2-3 years as the potentially worst team in the league in hopes that the development of that new culture could lead to championship level performances.

Again, it is a 36 month process. You are on month 5.

Much like the Bears this year, it is not about immediately winning.

I expect ISU to be where Indy State is right now a year from now. It looks like Schertz has figured it out really quick. Pedon should be expected to do the same. He needs to clean house and hit the portal hard! I bet he keeps the juniors he got in the portal for this year. What do you think?

 

[Adunk33]

I expect ISU to be where Indy State is right now a year from now. It looks like Schertz has figured it out really quick. Pedon should be expected to do the same. He needs to clean house and hit the portal hard! I bet he keeps the juniors he got in the portal for this year. What do you think?

I think Schertz brought a couple guys with him from his old school that he was 100% familiar with. They knew his system and could lead right away. In addition, he is an experienced HC. I expect progress next season but don't anticipate a 5-0 start to league play. I have a feeling that he's going to give the keys to a young Johnny Kizinger in a season to run the offense. Giving that to a freshman will come with it's own growing pains.

Just guessing, I think Pedon fills at least 3 schollies in the Spring.

 

[Redbird82]

FWIW I didn’t mean NCAA in 2 years if your good. But we should be .500 in the conference and over .500 overall next year. The points about the NIL are valid, but that will be from year 2 to 3, 5 to 6 or 10 to 11. You could be starting over more than you want every year you have learn to navigate it as a successful coach at our level.

 

[Redbird222]

I think Schertz brought a couple guys with him from his old school that he was 100% familiar with. They knew his system and could lead right away. In addition, he is an experienced HC. I expect progress next season but don't anticipate a 5-0 start to league play. I have a feeling that he's going to give the keys to a young Johnny Kizinger in a season to run the offense. Giving that to a freshman will come with it's own growing pains.

Just guessing, I think Pedon fills at least 3 schollies in the Spring.

Agreed 100%. I said in another thread I would expect 2 to 4 scholarships. I would anticipate an experienced front line player would be filled with one of them.

 

[CaliRdBrd]

There is not such a thing as overachieving. If you achieved it, you obviously aren't achieving over what you can achieve. Now, there is such a thing as exceeding expectations.

Pete Davidson is living proof that overachieving exists…

 

[RedbirdSoxFan]

I expect ISU to be where Indy State is right now a year from now. It looks like Schertz has figured it out really quick. Pedon should be expected to do the same. He needs to clean house and hit the portal hard! I bet he keeps the juniors he got in the portal for this year. What do you think?

I would expect that those who have used their transfer already will still be around:
Luke Kasubke
Malachi Poindexter
Darius Burford
Liam McChesney
Kendall Lewis

Recruits:
John Kinziger
Ty Pence
Chase Walker

Leaves room for five.

 

[SgtHulka]

I would expect that those who have used their transfer already will still be around:
Luke Kasubke
Malachi Poindexter
Darius Burford
Liam McChesney
Kendall Lewis

Recruits:
John Kinziger
Ty Pence
Chase Walker

Leaves room for five.

Need a Fab5 freshman class with the remainder from the portal. Every big on the team is a Muller hold over. Would like to keep Sissoko just for the Dinma potential to push us over the top of this schneid. The rest will likely move on, but not sure about Lewis at this point. He's got something going on. Other than fouls he's been pretty non existent recently. Is it mental, physical.... At any rate, A fresh start in the paint is likely coming, starting with Chase. We basically need 2 starters, or 3 if Lewis doesn't come around. We have some guys who can play, but not consistently and would be great for first off the bench roles.

 

[ILLST25]

Need a Fab5 freshman class with the remainder from the portal. Every big on the team is a Muller hold over. Would like to keep Sissoko just for the Dinma potential to push us over the top of this schneid. The rest will likely move on, but not sure about Lewis at this point. He's got something going on. Other than fouls he's been pretty non existent recently. Is it mental, physical.... At any rate, A fresh start in the paint is likely coming, starting with Chase. We basically need 2 starters, or 3 if Lewis doesn't come around. We have some guys who can play, but not consistently and would be great for first off the bench roles.

You guys are both forgetting Petrakis was a Pedon recruit and someone that has already transferred multiple times. I wonder if he and Kotov graduate and call it quits.

 

[RedbirdSoxFan]

You guys are both forgetting Petrakis was a Pedon recruit and someone that has already transferred multiple times.

He is a grad transfer, does he have eligibility left?

 

[Dmills]

He is a grad transfer, does he have eligibility left?

He has 1 year of eligibility left after this year.

18-19 Dodge City CC
19-20 Kansas State (RS)
20-21 Kansas State (Covid Year)
21-22 Western Carolina
22-23 Illinois State
23-24 ???

 

[RedbirdSoxFan]

He has 1 year of eligibility left after this year.

18-19 Dodge City CC
19-20 Kansas State (RS)
20-21 Kansas State (Covid Year)
21-22 Western Carolina
22-23 Illinois State
23-24 ???

So he’s eligible for the transfer portal without sitting?

 

[SgtHulka]

You guys are both forgetting Petrakis was a Pedon recruit and someone that has already transferred multiple times. I wonder if he and Kotov graduate and call it quits.

He's big. But he's not a big. 33 of his 47 shots have been 3s. We need the reverse. A guy who shoots 75% of his shots inside 5' . If Kotov is smart he does whatever it takes to stay on this side of the water

 

[redbirds2000]

Agreed 100%. I said in another thread I would expect 2 to 4 scholarships. I would anticipate an experienced front line player would be filled with one of them.

I am guessing Kasubke, Poindexter, Andrews, and Sissoko go to the portal? I am unsure of what eligibility the "seniors" have because of the Covid year, but Sandage, Knight, Lewis, Kotov, Petrakis, and Scmitt will be moving on too. Either through graduation or the portal. With the 3 Fresh signed, McChesney and Burford, that leaves 7-8 ( I am missing someone that is on scholly) scholarships to fill. Do you see any of those guys staying listed above? If so, why? I just don't see anyone on that list getting us to the top of the MVC. I guess they could be role players, but why burn the scholarship when you can take a chance in the portal and the worst case scenario you land another role player.

 

[redbirds2000]

I would expect that those who have used their transfer already will still be around:
Luke Kasubke
Malachi Poindexter
Darius Burford
Liam McChesney
Kendall Lewis

Recruits:
John Kinziger
Ty Pence
Chase Walker

Leaves room for five.

Why would those who have used their transfer already still be around? Pedon can still ask them to leave. They would have to sit out a year if they entered the portal, but that is not ISU's problem. I don't think ISU should be keeping guys around because they have to sit out when they transfer. Like I said, not ISU's problem.

 

[redbirds2000]

So he’s eligible for the transfer portal without sitting?

Either way, he needs to move on and open up a spot.

 

[Popsto4]

Need a Fab5 freshman class with the remainder from the portal. Every big on the team is a Muller hold over. Would like to keep Sissoko just for the Dinma potential to push us over the top of this schneid. The rest will likely move on, but not sure about Lewis at this point. He's got something going on. Other than fouls he's been pretty non existent recently. Is it mental, physical.... At any rate, A fresh start in the paint is likely coming, starting with Chase. We basically need 2 starters, or 3 if Lewis doesn't come around. We have some guys who can play, but not consistently and would be great for first off the bench roles.

I think Walker have better footwork than our current bigs. If he can get up and down the court is the question. If this group of players return or not is a moot point if the incoming class can’t make an immediate impact. I’d still look for a serviceable big in the portal as well. Kinsinger will be a very important piece going forward.

 

[DWRedbird]

I think Walker have better footwork than our current bigs. If he can get up and down the court is the question. If this group of players return or not is a moot point if the incoming class can’t make an immediate impact. I’d still look for a serviceable big in the portal as well. Kinsinger will be a very important piece going forward.

Walker's footwork, and size are very reminiscent of Cameron Krutwig from Loyola's NCAA runs. If he passes as well as Krutwig does and can figure out how to defend without fouling, he'll be a beast for us.

 

[FriscoBird90]

It took Rich Herrin four years to get SIU back to above .500 overall and into the NIT, and it took five years to get them back to above .500 in conference play "back in the day" when he managed to pull the Salukis off the ash heap. Times have changed since then, and that makes it difficult to make an apples-to-apples comparison, but Herrin was a respected coach who was given the time to build the Salukis into a solid NIT/NCAA tournament program. I think Pedon might be able to accomplish something similar in slightly quicker fashion given today's college basketball environment, but let's not kid ourselves as to just how deep the hole was on his first day in the office. My guess is Pedon knows he doesn't have an open-ended time frame in which to turn things around, but I would also guess he is working with a realistic set of expectations of his own and those of his bosses.