Chris Payton Decommits from Illinois State

[Chicagobirdfan]

Don't really disagree with ya.

I hate this mentality and do not consider it a win to have a kid verbal to ISU to just decommitt.

The first sentence was sarcasm. The last sentence was not.

Got it, tough to tell sarcasm on a message board. But people saying being in top 4 of Zion is a win was annoying to me as well. Being in the top 4 of recruits at Illinois is what got Bruce and groce fired. Let’s pray we get some impact guards in here ASAP.

 

[JHBird]

I think it’s hard to get kids to come here and stay her because this program isn’t fun. Yeah, I’ve seen the karaoke videos, but I’m talking about the style of play. Kids want a free-wheelin’, high flying, type of offense where they can create. Not a stodgy “Hoosier” style of offense with 4 passes before every shot. Just look at how far FGCU has come in a short amount of time.
Muller needs to let these kids fly. I mean, it makes zero sense recruiting all these long, athletic, types if you’re not gonna let ‘em be true to the style of play that got them here.
Plus lots of dunks, and alley-oops, put asses in the seats and create energy...something that has been sorely lacking for YEARS!

I feel the opposite. I expected Hooiser ball when Dan arrived. What I have gotten is different. Kids these days just want to shoot 3s and dunk. We shoot 3s to a very high degree .... too many sometimes. And anyone who wants to dunk, please feel free to do so. We finally had an excellent defensive team last year. That's what I expected from Dan, considering that was his trademark as a player. I don't find Dan's style to be the problem. And I think players find the style appealing. But he needs the horses to pull it off. Last year, he had them. This year, he doesn't.

We do shoot a lot of threes. Is that part of Dan's offensive mentality? If so we need to recruit some better shooters. It seems like half the time they just aimlessly pass it around then end up having to shoot a three because a player finally got bored. I'm pretty sure that's one statistic where we are near the top in the nation - the pct of three point shots taken per game. Of course we make them at lower than average rate, which means we shouldn't be shooting them as much since they aren't our strength, right??

 

[CaliRdBrd]

I think it’s hard to get kids to come here and stay her because this program isn’t fun. Yeah, I’ve seen the karaoke videos, but I’m talking about the style of play. Kids want a free-wheelin’, high flying, type of offense where they can create. Not a stodgy “Hoosier” style of offense with 4 passes before every shot. Just look at how far FGCU has come in a short amount of time.
Muller needs to let these kids fly. I mean, it makes zero sense recruiting all these long, athletic, types if you’re not gonna let ‘em be true to the style of play that got them here.
Plus lots of dunks, and alley-oops, put asses in the seats and create energy...something that has been sorely lacking for YEARS!

I'm not sure style of play had anything to do with it. However, recruits become friends with current players. Most of the time your best recruiters are your players. It wouldn't surprise me if the guys Payton had been spending time with and talking to on this team mentioned how they feel about Muller.

You can call it discipline or whatever you would like, but a high percentage of players since Dan took over haven't liked playing for Muller. Even the seniors last year couldn't stand Muller most of the time. I would guess the treatment of this current group hasn't been pleasant and Payton probably was being told about it from players on the team.

Wow! Honestly, I figure the players typically will have issues with the head coach, in any sport. What you’re saying sounds like there is a complete disconnect. Is this heresay?

 

[Rollbirds5]

I think it’s hard to get kids to come here and stay her because this program isn’t fun. Yeah, I’ve seen the karaoke videos, but I’m talking about the style of play. Kids want a free-wheelin’, high flying, type of offense where they can create. Not a stodgy “Hoosier” style of offense with 4 passes before every shot. Just look at how far FGCU has come in a short amount of time.
Muller needs to let these kids fly. I mean, it makes zero sense recruiting all these long, athletic, types if you’re not gonna let ‘em be true to the style of play that got them here.
Plus lots of dunks, and alley-oops, put asses in the seats and create energy...something that has been sorely lacking for YEARS!

I'm not sure style of play had anything to do with it. However, recruits become friends with current players. Most of the time your best recruiters are your players. It wouldn't surprise me if the guys Payton had been spending time with and talking to on this team mentioned how they feel about Muller.

You can call it discipline or whatever you would like, but a high percentage of players since Dan took over haven't liked playing for Muller. Even the seniors last year couldn't stand Muller most of the time. I would guess the treatment of this current group hasn't been pleasant and Payton probably was being told about it from players on the team.

Wow! Honestly, I figure the players typically will have issues with the head coach, in any sport. What you’re saying sounds like there is a complete disconnect. Is this heresay?

Not sure I completely agree as at least Paris and Tony and I believe Mikyle have praised Muller on twitter. I think any head coach player relationship is good at times and bad at times, most likely depends on if you are winning or losing. Losing means coach is making you run or more likely to be tough on you and many players in today's age don't handle tough coaching even though it helps you as you progress in your playing career

 

[SoCalRedbird]

Payton goes to every almost every game. Why would he want to go to ISU and their half empty stadium with poor support when he's getting calls from the big boys?

Easy.

So he can give his team, his hometown, and Illinois State University a reason. But then again, most 18 year-olds aren't mature enough or ambitious enough to step into that kind of responsibility. They can and often do take the path of least resistance.

I'm not knocking the kid's choice though. It is what it is.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

 

[ISU FAN 1]

I think it’s hard to get kids to come here and stay her because this program isn’t fun. Yeah, I’ve seen the karaoke videos, but I’m talking about the style of play. Kids want a free-wheelin’, high flying, type of offense where they can create. Not a stodgy “Hoosier” style of offense with 4 passes before every shot. Just look at how far FGCU has come in a short amount of time.
Muller needs to let these kids fly. I mean, it makes zero sense recruiting all these long, athletic, types if you’re not gonna let ‘em be true to the style of play that got them here.
Plus lots of dunks, and alley-oops, put asses in the seats and create energy...something that has been sorely lacking for YEARS!

I'm not sure style of play had anything to do with it. However, recruits become friends with current players. Most of the time your best recruiters are your players. It wouldn't surprise me if the guys Payton had been spending time with and talking to on this team mentioned how they feel about Muller.

You can call it discipline or whatever you would like, but a high percentage of players since Dan took over haven't liked playing for Muller. Even the seniors last year couldn't stand Muller most of the time. I would guess the treatment of this current group hasn't been pleasant and Payton probably was being told about it from players on the team.

Times have changed for the worse if we are losing out on players because Dan isn’t warm and fuzzy enough.

 

[V Boy]

I would actually like to know what Redbird Recon, CPacmel, Bird Friend, Hulka think about this. Is this a devastating blow for ISU or just another day in college basketball?

What is the sentiment from the insiders about the impact of this de-commit? Does it impact the current team? Coaching staff? Does it impact other recruits? Does it impact our prospects for landing other players we were after for 2018 or 2019?

 

[ISU FAN 1]

I would actually like to know what Redbird Recon, CPacmel, Bird Friend, Hulka think about this. Is this a devastating blow for ISU or just another day in college basketball?

What is the sentiment from the insiders about the impact of this de-commit? Does it impact the current team? Coaching staff? Does it impact other recruits? Does it impact our prospects for landing other players we were after for 2018 or 2019?

While I respect that collection of basketball wisdom, I think the impact can be measured by the interest from Bill Self at Kansas. To me, that indicates Payton is a pretty big deal.

I think it's a devastating blow, and just another day in Redbird basketball.

 

[HailISNU]

I think any head coach player relationship is good at times and bad at times, most likely depends on if you are winning or losing.

This makes sense. But if our players can find a way to be unhappy while going 17-1 in conference... I don't know how you fix that. If that's actually the case I wouldn't blame Dan for jumping at the next offer he gets.

 

[ISU FAN 1]

I'm announcing that I'm de-committing as a Redbird fan, but want ISU (and this forum) to rest assured that I will continue to consider ISU as I mull over my options.

 

[ThisIsTheLineup]

We could be undefeated and ranked right now - I don't think he still would stay. He is getting looks by some BIG programs now. It sucks, but he is a high school kid. It get it. We just respect his decision, hope he re-commits (with a lot of luck) and if not - move on.

 

[Jsnhbe1Birds]

He can go there and sit and transfer back

 

[Hamdonger]

I think it’s hard to get kids to come here and stay her because this program isn’t fun. Yeah, I’ve seen the karaoke videos, but I’m talking about the style of play. Kids want a free-wheelin’, high flying, type of offense where they can create. Not a stodgy “Hoosier” style of offense with 4 passes before every shot. Just look at how far FGCU has come in a short amount of time.
Muller needs to let these kids fly. I mean, it makes zero sense recruiting all these long, athletic, types if you’re not gonna let ‘em be true to the style of play that got them here.
Plus lots of dunks, and alley-oops, put asses in the seats and create energy...something that has been sorely lacking for YEARS!

I'm not sure style of play had anything to do with it. However, recruits become friends with current players. Most of the time your best recruiters are your players. It wouldn't surprise me if the guys Payton had been spending time with and talking to on this team mentioned how they feel about Muller.

You can call it discipline or whatever you would like, but a high percentage of players since Dan took over haven't liked playing for Muller. Even the seniors last year couldn't stand Muller most of the time. I would guess the treatment of this current group hasn't been pleasant and Payton probably was being told about it from players on the team.

Calling BS on this, Rico. A "high percentage." Hmmm. He's getting recruited by freaking KANSAS. C'mon, man.

https://goo.gl/images/R9grFj

 

[Hamdonger]

BTW, that link is a pic of Dan getting mobbed by his players last year celebrating a marquee win for him.

 

[MadBird]

Count me among the "meh" crowd at this point. The kid never stepped on the court with ISU. We haven't "lost" anything. He might end up a "journeyman" wherever he goes (let's hope it isn't up or down I-74 either direction!!). He's a 16 or 17 or 18 year old kid. He makes an early early commitment. He changes his mind. Hard for me to get too worked up one way or the other.

It would be nice to get him, assuming he ends up being a "top recruit". Won't be the first local kid who, like almost all of us, wanted to get away from home to go to college. We didn't get Ron Curry 25 years ago, we didn't get Bates-Diop, etc. etc. Lots of kids go away.

Wisconsin just had this happen to them, got an early commit from Milwaukee area kid Tyler Herro in his junior year, he blew up last summer, de-committed and is now a top 75 or something and going to Kentucky. Wisconsin's been to the NCAA like 20 years in a row. Crap happens to even very solid programs.

It's like watching TV these last few days - everyone looking for a winner and loser. Why does this have to be a "blow to the program" or evidence of Muller's crappy coaching or team culture or the athletic department's failure to do this or that? A teenager changed his mind. Let's move on.

 

[Hamdonger]

I think it’s hard to get kids to come here and stay her because this program isn’t fun. Yeah, I’ve seen the karaoke videos, but I’m talking about the style of play. Kids want a free-wheelin’, high flying, type of offense where they can create. Not a stodgy “Hoosier” style of offense with 4 passes before every shot. Just look at how far FGCU has come in a short amount of time.
Muller needs to let these kids fly. I mean, it makes zero sense recruiting all these long, athletic, types if you’re not gonna let ‘em be true to the style of play that got them here.
Plus lots of dunks, and alley-oops, put asses in the seats and create energy...something that has been sorely lacking for YEARS!

I'm not sure style of play had anything to do with it. However, recruits become friends with current players. Most of the time your best recruiters are your players. It wouldn't surprise me if the guys Payton had been spending time with and talking to on this team mentioned how they feel about Muller.

You can call it discipline or whatever you would like, but a high percentage of players since Dan took over haven't liked playing for Muller. Even the seniors last year couldn't stand Muller most of the time. I would guess the treatment of this current group hasn't been pleasant and Payton probably was being told about it from players on the team.

Even the seniors last year?? That's even funnier. You've never seen a tighter pair in a season, from a coach/player relationship, than Dan Muller and Paris Lee. Remember that Dan was TOUGH on Paris in his early yrs. He stayed tough on him, but Paris grew and understood the dynamic of getting better and maturity from a much greater perspective by the end of his career. Now he thanks Dan for it.

I think maybe Paris won POY last year. I think?

Again, most players, at one point or another, have a beef with their coach...at least internally. Dan mentioned he even thought about transferring.

I'm not the least bit concerned about players not "liking" Dan. Cause for the most part, I'm not buying it. Also, this is a tough year. I imagine the players are pretty much sick of each other right now...until we get some momentum.

 

[Hamdonger]

BTW, I don't think anyone intentionally called his commit and then de-commit a "win."

 

[ISU FAN 1]

The no big deal attitude about this from some on here reminds me that some ISU fans aren't that interested in a winning program. To them, ISU basketball is just something to kill their life clock until it's time to lay down and get comfortable. To each their own, I suppose, in defining their fandom. IMO, the no big deal attitude translates to the shitty atmosphere in our arena. Again, more excitement in the high school gyms Payton has been playing in. I can see why there's an attract and retain problem at ISU.

 

[bb fan]

Oh.... Soooo very sorry ISU FAN #1. This is clearly the end of the world for our sorry ass program. The end is near. For ISU, for the Valley, and everything we hold dear. Thanks for telling us how we are always supposed to act about everything affecting our program -- the Debble Downer way.

For the record, I never expressed an opinion on Peyton one way or the another. But I will humbly apologize for the board for not responding the way you DD's think we should.

 

[ISU FAN 1]

Oh.... Soooo very sorry ISU FAN #1. This is clearly the end of the world for our sorry ass program. The end is near. For ISU, for the Valley, and everything we hold dear. Thanks for telling us how we are always supposed to act about everything affecting our program -- the Debble Downer way.

For the record, I never express an opinion on Peyton one way or the another. But I will humbly apologize for the board for not responding the way you think we should.

I said some. If the show fits, wear it. Since you don't even know how to spell Payton's name, I'm guessing it fits quite nicely.