Indy St

[ricohill]

Also, as much as I don’t like the way Copeland and Boyd play. I watch these games, neither one is a great ballhandler (Boyd is better than Copeland). Our entire offense is them (or other guards) trying to go driving into a set defense hoping to make something happen. Big Rey has the touch of a bull in a glass shop. Why in the world do we not have our big guys set screens away from the ball to get them open for shots? Maybe the other team helps and Rey could dive to the basket for a layup? This offense that Jones put in is exactly as bad as I predicted when I saw his offensive efficiency numbers (all bad) at North Dakota.

 

[CaliRdBrd]

Yesterday's game gave me the opportunity to think that we may actually
be a 10th place team in the MVC and a Loser on Thursday night in St. Lou.

How can that be? Oh......it be.

Some speak to firing Dan. Can't/won't happen with the contract. Is Dan the type
of individual who will step forward, speak to Lyons and Dietz about just compromising on
a settlement and departing? If all 3 gentlemen agree we are in a hopeless situation these talks
could happen I guess. If I were Dan and living this situation it would cross my mind to do the Right
Thing and settle.

He has to be miserable at this juncture. A settlement that could be stretched out over X years and digestible
for the University to move forward. Dan would leave and most would honor him for his integrity.

I have always been in Dan's corner but all I had to do was watch the first 2 minutes of yesterday's game and know R Birds
are in serious trouble. Our kids have 0 confidence and we R Tight. The remaining minutes were no different with certain players
not having the confidence make a crisp pass or even a simple dribble drive move without kicking or losing the ball. These kids
are shaken and our skill is NOT as bad as it plays.

So early in conference play and feel no excitement or entertainment value in the games ahead. Tough to be a sad Bird.

Honestly, I would have less respect for Dan if he asked for some kind of settlement.

You gotta understand guys that play/played sports at the level Muller did, did so because, in part, they are ferocious competitors. No way he quits on this team. If he did, he’d never land another job at this level.

In addition, based on last year, who really thought this team would be any good this year? If you did, you were a pie-in-the-sky Kool- Aid chugger. That team last year was absolutely horrible and we lost the few decent players we did have.

You really need to give him one more year to see if any of these kids develop. In 2021, if we’re looking at the same product, he needs to let go.

 

[ricohill]

Yesterday's game gave me the opportunity to think that we may actually
be a 10th place team in the MVC and a Loser on Thursday night in St. Lou.

How can that be? Oh......it be.

Some speak to firing Dan. Can't/won't happen with the contract. Is Dan the type
of individual who will step forward, speak to Lyons and Dietz about just compromising on
a settlement and departing? If all 3 gentlemen agree we are in a hopeless situation these talks
could happen I guess. If I were Dan and living this situation it would cross my mind to do the Right
Thing and settle.

He has to be miserable at this juncture. A settlement that could be stretched out over X years and digestible
for the University to move forward. Dan would leave and most would honor him for his integrity.

I have always been in Dan's corner but all I had to do was watch the first 2 minutes of yesterday's game and know R Birds
are in serious trouble. Our kids have 0 confidence and we R Tight. The remaining minutes were no different with certain players
not having the confidence make a crisp pass or even a simple dribble drive move without kicking or losing the ball. These kids
are shaken and our skill is NOT as bad as it plays.

So early in conference play and feel no excitement or entertainment value in the games ahead. Tough to be a sad Bird.

Honestly, I would have less respect for Dan if he asked for some kind of settlement.

You gotta understand guys that play/played sports at the level Muller did, did so because, in part, they are ferocious competitors. No way he quits on this team. If he did, he’d never land another job at this level.

In addition, based on last year, who really thought this team would be any good this year? If you did, you were a pie-in-the-sky Kool- Aid chugger. That team last year was absolutely horrible and we lost the few decent players we did have.

You really need to give him one more year to see if any of these kids develop. In 2021, if we’re looking at the same product, he needs to let go.

If these kids come back...the body language scares me on a couple young guys. That’s why I’m pissed that Dan and the coaching staff looks like they give up during games.

Play Horne and Reeves 35 minutes. Get them better for the future and hope they want to come back and play. We all know what Copeland and Torres can do. They are both gone at the end of the year.

 

[TIMMY]

Dear God I agree with Rico.

 

[ricohill]

Dear God I agree with Rico.

Is your Foe button not working? Thanks for reading.

 

[DBird]

Dear God I agree with Rico.

 

[V Boy]

X

 

[SoCalRedbird]

I have always been in Dan's corner but all I had to do was watch the first 2 minutes of yesterday's game and know R Birds
are in serious trouble. Our kids have 0 confidence and we R Tight.

I think you're right about having no confidence, which, on this scale, would indicate a serious rift between the staff and players. Nothing else explains how we looked versus Belmont and @ Cincy versus our effort so far in the month of January.

Does anyone have any info on what's going on behind the scenes?

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

 

[V Boy]

Rico’s insights are usually good.

I like RedbirdRon’s posts too, although not sure I agree on the comment around the talent not being as bad as it looks.

Horne has some talent.

Reeves some talent.

Boyd has some too, although I don’t see him meshing with the style of play Muller wants (motion...multiple passes...willingness to give up the ball to get best shot for team). So that basically negates that talent.

Outside of that I see a pretty severe talent gap between ISU and the rest of the league. I see a lot of slow big dudes who basically can’t score, aren’t good rebounders and can’t defend 1on1.

My main point in the other thread was that there is a time gap between the crash and when Muller brought in new competent assistants (which is this year). When you couple that recruiting gap with the track record of sub-par player development...:you get this team.

Next years class is by far Muller’s most important one. If those kids can’t instantly take minutes from Idowu, Fisher and Chastain, then I think The program will hit Tom Richardson territory.

 

[SoCalRedbird]

When you couple that recruiting gap with the track record of sub-par player development...:you get this team.

Muller's inability to recruit impacts us much more than his ability to develop talent. Hard to truly assess player development when our team is consistently cobbled together using D1 transfers, JUCO transfers, grad transfers, first year freshmen, the return of often-injured players, and occasionally significant players that decide to return.

Consistency is essential in making any sort of progress. Illinois State's annual carousel of assistant coaches and random cast of characters are anything but consistent. You can't win that way.

But why doesn't Dan know that?



Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

 

[V Boy]

When you couple that recruiting gap with the track record of sub-par player development...:you get this team.

Muller's inability to recruit impacts us much more than his ability to develop talent. Hard to truly assess player development when our team is consistently cobbled together using D1 transfers, JUCO transfers, grad transfers, first year freshmen, the return of often-injured players, and occasionally significant players that decide to return.

Consistency is essential in making any sort of progress. Illinois State's annual carousel of assistant coaches and random cast of characters are anything but consistent. You can't win that way.

But why doesn't Dan know that?



Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

Gonzaga is now the No 1 team in the country and has been bringing in talent and developing talent that way for the last 20+ years.

Outside of a few programs, this is just how college basketball is now. It’s going to be more that way in the future too.

 

[Hamdonger]

I don’t know if Dan will agree to this. I could see him thinking he can fix this. Plus, the options for Dan have to be bleak. Going back to being an assistant and having to work hard?

This is the kind of statement that makes you a tool, in my mind. Can you possibly, possibly state your case on a consistent basis without being a tool?? Even the creepy cobwebbed corners of Redbirdfan have your tattoo of disapproval on them, therefore even the spiders here know where you stand. We know where you stand. Ok?

BUYOUTS are, not always, but generally negotiated and leveraged after the firing...even with 'guaranteed' buyout terms. Negotiated on dollar amount and length of time to settle the financial terms...leveraged in the fact that if coach should find himself employed as a D1 basketball coach during the course of buyout contract, said buyout is generally reduced ...sometimes substantially depending on the new salary of fired coach.

You've got people of "importance," in and outside the program (no not you Rico) grumbling about our basketball program's trend. Outside of the normal grumbling. Been going on a while. Dan is very well thought of in ISU admin circles as he should be.

But the trend is becomong glaringly obvious. Whether or not we can "afford" the buyout won't matter if the trend continues over next 2 months. Read between the lines.

In the meantime rooting for the Redbirds and their coaches. To the one who said they'll be rooting for ISU to lose every game from here on out this year...get lost and don't set foot in Redbird again.

 

[ricohill]

“ This is the kind of statement that makes you a tool, in my mind. Can you possibly, possibly state your case on a consistent basis without being a tool?? Even the creepy cobwebbed corners of Redbirdfan have your tattoo of disapproval on them, therefore even the spiders here know where you stand. We know where you stand. Ok?

BUYOUTS are, not always, but generally negotiated and leveraged after the firing...even with 'guaranteed' buyout terms. Negotiated on dollar amount and length of time to settle the financial terms...leveraged in the fact that if coach should find himself employed as a D1 basketball coach during the course of buyout contract, said buyout is generally reduced ...sometimes substantially depending on the new salary of fired coach.

You've got people of "importance," in and outside the program (no not you Rico) grumbling about our basketball program's trend. Outside of the normal grumbling. Been going on a while. Dan is very well thought of in ISU admin circles as he should be.

But the trend is becomong glaringly obvious. Whether or not we can "afford" the buyout won't matter if the trend continues over next 2 months. Read between the lines.

In the meantime rooting for the Redbirds and their coaches. To the one who said they'll be rooting for ISU to lose every game from here on out this year...get lost and don't set foot in Redbird again”

Since Humdinger took this down, I’ll reply.

A. I know plenty of people that have questioned how hard Muller works. He’s not know as that hard working of a gear coach. So I don’t think his life will be as much fun grinding it out for someone like Brad Underwood.

B. If we have admins that make decisions because they like Dan we need new admins. He’s had a ton of players arrested and not winning. What is he doing that they like?

 

[SgtHulka]

“ This is the kind of statement that makes you a tool, in my mind. Can you possibly, possibly state your case on a consistent basis without being a tool?? Even the creepy cobwebbed corners of Redbirdfan have your tattoo of disapproval on them, therefore even the spiders here know where you stand. We know where you stand. Ok?

BUYOUTS are, not always, but generally negotiated and leveraged after the firing...even with 'guaranteed' buyout terms. Negotiated on dollar amount and length of time to settle the financial terms...leveraged in the fact that if coach should find himself employed as a D1 basketball coach during the course of buyout contract, said buyout is generally reduced ...sometimes substantially depending on the new salary of fired coach.

You've got people of "importance," in and outside the program (no not you Rico) grumbling about our basketball program's trend. Outside of the normal grumbling. Been going on a while. Dan is very well thought of in ISU admin circles as he should be.

But the trend is becomong glaringly obvious. Whether or not we can "afford" the buyout won't matter if the trend continues over next 2 months. Read between the lines.

In the meantime rooting for the Redbirds and their coaches. To the one who said they'll be rooting for ISU to lose every game from here on out this year...get lost and don't set foot in Redbird again”

Since Humdinger took this down, I’ll reply.

A. I know plenty of people that have questioned how hard Muller works. He’s not know as that hard working of a gear coach. So I don’t think his life will be as much fun grinding it out for someone like Brad Underwood.

B. If we have admins that make decisions because they like Dan we need new admins. He’s had a ton of players arrested and not winning. What is he doing that they like?

Missed the game. This probably sums it all up. Thanks

 

[ISU FAN 1]

I'm pissed about this game. I cannot WAIT for the Drake game! I hope like hell this team is pissed too and focused on doing whatever the hell they can to make sure they leave Des Moines with a W. Show some pride...win this f'n game!

At this point I want them to lose every game so Dan gets fired. Can't keep your job at 6-25 regardless of contract. They'll find a way. Play wack for Yak is what I'm calling it.

But think what Dan will do with that high draft pick. Probably what Lyons would think.

 

[ISU FAN 1]

Yesterday's game gave me the opportunity to think that we may actually
be a 10th place team in the MVC and a Loser on Thursday night in St. Lou.

How can that be? Oh......it be.

Some speak to firing Dan. Can't/won't happen with the contract. Is Dan the type
of individual who will step forward, speak to Lyons and Dietz about just compromising on
a settlement and departing? If all 3 gentlemen agree we are in a hopeless situation these talks
could happen I guess. If I were Dan and living this situation it would cross my mind to do the Right
Thing and settle.

He has to be miserable at this juncture. A settlement that could be stretched out over X years and digestible
for the University to move forward. Dan would leave and most would honor him for his integrity.

I have always been in Dan's corner but all I had to do was watch the first 2 minutes of yesterday's game and know R Birds
are in serious trouble. Our kids have 0 confidence and we R Tight. The remaining minutes were no different with certain players
not having the confidence make a crisp pass or even a simple dribble drive move without kicking or losing the ball. These kids
are shaken and our skill is NOT as bad as it plays.

So early in conference play and feel no excitement or entertainment value in the games ahead. Tough to be a sad Bird.

So hard to be miserable making $600K per year. Money can’t buy happiness, but being broke is a major buzz kill. Besides, what would Mrs. Muller think of Dan walking away from $600K? Imagine that conversation.

 

[ISU FAN 1]

“ This is the kind of statement that makes you a tool, in my mind. Can you possibly, possibly state your case on a consistent basis without being a tool?? Even the creepy cobwebbed corners of Redbirdfan have your tattoo of disapproval on them, therefore even the spiders here know where you stand. We know where you stand. Ok?

BUYOUTS are, not always, but generally negotiated and leveraged after the firing...even with 'guaranteed' buyout terms. Negotiated on dollar amount and length of time to settle the financial terms...leveraged in the fact that if coach should find himself employed as a D1 basketball coach during the course of buyout contract, said buyout is generally reduced ...sometimes substantially depending on the new salary of fired coach.

You've got people of "importance," in and outside the program (no not you Rico) grumbling about our basketball program's trend. Outside of the normal grumbling. Been going on a while. Dan is very well thought of in ISU admin circles as he should be.

But the trend is becomong glaringly obvious. Whether or not we can "afford" the buyout won't matter if the trend continues over next 2 months. Read between the lines.

In the meantime rooting for the Redbirds and their coaches. To the one who said they'll be rooting for ISU to lose every game from here on out this year...get lost and don't set foot in Redbird again”

Since Humdinger took this down, I’ll reply.

A. I know plenty of people that have questioned how hard Muller works. He’s not know as that hard working of a gear coach. So I don’t think his life will be as much fun grinding it out for someone like Brad Underwood.

B. If we have admins that make decisions because they like Dan we need new admins. He’s had a ton of players arrested and not winning. What is he doing that they like?

https://youtu.be/d2gNfIsSHBg

 

[isuquinndog]

When you couple that recruiting gap with the track record of sub-par player development...:you get this team.

Muller's inability to recruit impacts us much more than his ability to develop talent. Hard to truly assess player development when our team is consistently cobbled together using D1 transfers, JUCO transfers, grad transfers, first year freshmen, the return of often-injured players, and occasionally significant players that decide to return.

Consistency is essential in making any sort of progress. Illinois State's annual carousel of assistant coaches and random cast of characters are anything but consistent. You can't win that way.

But why doesn't Dan know that?



Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

I mean our 2020-2021 roster (as of now, I know transfers, etc) is full. That hasn't happened in a long time. Three freshman and a JUCO.

 

[ISU FAN 1]

When you couple that recruiting gap with the track record of sub-par player development...:you get this team.

Muller's inability to recruit impacts us much more than his ability to develop talent. Hard to truly assess player development when our team is consistently cobbled together using D1 transfers, JUCO transfers, grad transfers, first year freshmen, the return of often-injured players, and occasionally significant players that decide to return.

Consistency is essential in making any sort of progress. Illinois State's annual carousel of assistant coaches and random cast of characters are anything but consistent. You can't win that way.

But why doesn't Dan know that?



Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

I mean our 2020-2021 roster (as of now, I know transfers, etc) is full. That hasn't happened in a long time. Three freshman and a JUCO.

We have a couple freshmen I like. Hoping next year’s group stacks on to that, with pressure on Sissoko to be the next mailman. Seeing more agreement with the go all in with Horne and Reeves strategy I called for during TCU game. Dan should deploy a youth strategy to somehow justify what’s projecting to be an 11-19 season.

 

[Buffett]

Its year 8 for coach, and we suck.