vs #10 Evansville - 2024 MVC Tournament First Round - Thursday, 3/7/2024 - 6 pm - Bally Sports

[Moreorless]

I think the worry is that he will get frustrated at the losing culture and leave in the portal.

I don’t think he’s going anywhere. Right now he’s the little big fish in a small pond. There are some monsters out there. The kid can flat out play though and is definitely a winner.

 

[CaliRdBrd]

Question- Do you think Walker will be a Redbird for the next three years?

You've also posted that you're worried about ISU's ability to keep him.

So, if you don't think he'll be a Redbird for the next three years, why do you care about burning one of his years of eligibility?

I am worried (if he pans out). I care about his eligibility because if he truly was able to play from the beginning of the season, we could have used him.
Water under the bridge now.

 

[CaliRdBrd]

Another quote for those worrying about JK:

"It was a great setting and it was a great experience. It's not the outcome we wanted at all. Credit to Evansville. But you know, we're gonna take this and we're just gonna use this for next year because we're gonna be back here," Kinziger said.

Ever heard of “Coach-speak”? This is “player-speak”.

 

[Manchester Matt]

Ever heard of “Coach-speak”? This is “player-speak”.

Or maybe, just maybe, he likes the school and coach who recruited him. I know, hard to fathom for the every player is going to transfer crowd.

 

[CaliRdBrd]

JK is a winner in a loser program. I’m in the group that believes he stays next season. But if next season ends up like this one; he’s gone. You must have a program that quality players want to play for and stay at. Facing facts; that’s not ISU.

JK is staying next year. Book it! If he doesn't, come back to this comment and roast me!

We all hope so, but once those P5’s start dangling all that NIL money, along with playing regularly for a winning program on national TV, he may start singing a different tune.

 

[CaliRdBrd]

Or maybe, just maybe, he likes the school and coach who recruited him. I know, hard to fathom for the every player is going to transfer crowd.

Maybe. I hope so.

Loyalty is a boomer term. Kids are different these days though.

Sincerely,

Boomer Cali

 

[Hamdonger]

Johnny.

The dominoes haven't begun to fall yet in the college basketball scene (sans Mullins). Johnny had a 6 game stretch where he was around 20 a game...IN A SUBSTANDARD OFFENSE, and as an overmatched guard.

He's very intelligent on the court - our highest IQ player jmo. He's very tough-minded despite getting his ass knocked around all year, and he has PROVEN that he can hit a shot almost anywhere on the court. He effectively gets to the paint better than any other guard we have. He also has a knack for knowing where to be on the court...in regards to a good shot or a good pass, or hek, even defensively in terms of knowing where to be. He came up with some BIG defensive plays for us. Last half of year he's in the argument for our best overall player on the team. Myles had better numbers - MUCH needed(!) - but Johnny makes those around him better. I'm not saying that with gaga eyes, either. It's realism.

DO NOT forget the ridiculous amount of woo'ing that goes on with programs bigger than ours. Once the dominoes start, you never know if a bigger program will find themselves with a gap that Johnny can fill. IMAGINE JOHNNY's IQ in a good offense...surrounded by better players. I'm not saying he's leaving. I think it's a better chance that he stays vs leaving. 80/20. I am saying...we are not safe, folks. While much room for improvement, I AM convinced he can play in a bigger program...and be successful. His size does hurt him, but his mind helps him. We don't need athletes, although that's nice. We need basketball players, and so does every other team. Johnny...is a basketball player.

We don't have much, currently, to woo with...other than relationships. And as we all know, or should know...that is MOST important and means everything - but in today's college basketball landscape, it doesn't seem to be worth sht. For every kid who is a pretty good player, you will be re-recruited every...single...year.

Expect Johnny to be recruited. Food for thought.

 

[ScoreboardDotRace]

The Pantagraph is a dinosaur and isn’t making the right moves to make it in the digital world.

I would be surprised if they even have sports coverage beyond AP articles. Maybe AI generated local articles after Randy leaves.

It’s a shame because I feel awhile back that ISU did have some of the best coverage in the Midwest via the Pantagraph. But, that was also decades ago and full staffs ago.

 

[Redbird222]

Johnny.

The dominoes haven't begun to fall yet in the college basketball scene (sans Mullins). Johnny had a 6 game stretch where he was around 20 a game...IN A SUBSTANDARD OFFENSE, and as an overmatched guard.

He's very intelligent on the court - our highest IQ player jmo. He's very tough-minded despite getting his ass knocked around all year, and he has PROVEN that he can hit a shot almost anywhere on the court. He effectively gets to the paint better than any other guard we have. He also has a knack for knowing where to be on the court...in regards to a good shot or a good pass, or hek, even defensively in terms of knowing where to be. He came up with some BIG defensive plays for us. Last half of year he's in the argument for our best overall player on the team. Myles had better numbers - MUCH needed(!) - but Johnny makes those around him better. I'm not saying that with gaga eyes, either. It's realism.

DO NOT forget the ridiculous amount of woo'ing that goes on with programs bigger than ours. Once the dominoes start, you never know if a bigger program will find themselves with a gap that Johnny can fill. IMAGINE JOHNNY's IQ in a good offense...surrounded by better players. I'm not saying he's leaving. I think it's a better chance that he stays vs leaving. 80/20. I am saying...we are not safe, folks. While much room for improvement, I AM convinced he can play in a bigger program...and be successful. His size does hurt him, but his mind helps him. We don't need athletes, although that's nice. We need basketball players, and so does every other team. Johnny...is a basketball player.

We don't have much, currently, to woo with...other than relationships. And as we all know, or should know...that is MOST important and means everything - but in today's college basketball landscape, it doesn't seem to be worth sht. For every kid who is a pretty good player, you will be re-recruited every...single...year.

Expect Johnny to be recruited. Food for thought.

There are so many facets of his game that I like but here are the 2 reasons I don't see him getting poached to the Big 10

1. He does struggle at times when more physical, quick, players apply ball pressure.
2. He is scrappy and fights like hell but teams can take advantage of him in the post on switches and with posting guards. The match-up zone suited him well and took him out of these situations

I think he needs to develop his body more for serious consideration. Just my opinion.

That being said I don't think he will be back next year. I don't have any insights ... its just how I see him from what I have observed.

 

[RedbirdSoxFan]

There are so many facets of his game that I like but here are the 2 reasons I don't see him getting poached to the Big 10

1. He does struggle at times when more physical, quick, players apply ball pressure.
2. He is scrappy and fights like hell but teams can take advantage of him in the post on switches and with posting guards. The match-up zone suited him well and took him out of these situations

I think he needs to develop his body more for serious consideration. Just my opinion.

That being said I don't think he will be back next year. I don't have any insights ... its just how I see him from what I have observed.

When you say “next year”, are you referring to next year meaning next season, or “next year”meaning 2025-26 season?

 

[Redbird222]

When you say “next year”, are you referring to next year meaning next season, or “next year”meaning 2025-26 season?

Next season but I typed that wrong ... I don't see him leaving next season. Sorry about that

 

[dpdoughbird06]

Question- Do you think Walker will be a Redbird for the next three years?

You've also posted that you're worried about ISU's ability to keep him.

So, if you don't think he'll be a Redbird for the next three years, why do you care about burning one of his years of eligibility?

Do all players want to stay in college for five years? I can’t speak from experience, as it took me seven years to finally matriculate out of ISU, but there’s something to be said for getting a degree in four years and getting on with life.

I’m glad the Covid year has finally run its course, since it was getting weird watching professional college players in their sixth year of eligibility.

 

[dpdoughbird06]

Another fan said to me during the last days of the Muller era that ‘sometimes programs fall so low they can’t be brought back’. Given the portal and NIL money, ISU may be one of those programs. But what can you do? Stick with the Birds or get a lobotomy and become a Bradley fan. As a long suffering Cubs and Bears fan I guess I’ll stick with the Birds and hope for a miracle.

Bradley during the Geno Ford years fell about as low as you could go. Enter Wardle and we magically forget just how bad they were not so long ago. We’ll be back…at some point.

 

[dpdoughbird06]

I understand people wanting to support ISU basketball no matter what and people that may be friends of the current coaches, management, staff and employed by ISU trying to look at the sunny side of this program. But, the big but is hardly anyone in central Illinois within an hour’s driving distance cares what happens with this program. That was not the case in the 80s and 90s. There were a lot of “casual” fans that showed up as recently as the débâcle against UCF in the NIT tournament. Which is becoming distant history. With the portal and ball players wanting to play two years should show you what to expect in the future. It is a different ballgame today. Look at Southern, a guy at Champaign and a guy at Purdue makes them a lot different ball club, but, yes another but, what did they do to backfill the departures?

ISU needs to turn the losing into winning very quickly or who would want to come here. Players that didn’t see the court where they were at? Foster was a great pick up but in this day and age one probably needs three of them every year, not just to add but to replace what will leave. I will take the one and dones if they get ISU back to respectability.

Just get ISU back to being a top four finisher in the valley. That is not a real big ask.

As for the culture comments and assessment. ISU had another losing season. End of the day wins versus losses, how far did you advance in STL, and did you dance either NIT or NCAA. Build a respectable program which for the average fan is based on the measuring sticks above. Anything else is a reflection of not only how far the program has fallen ,but also how far our own expectations have fallen.

Top-four finishes in the Valley are not a big ask - until you have 12 fan bases saying and believing this. Everyone thinks they should be top tier every year, but the numbers game still says only a third ever will.

Unless we suddenly start throwing in far more resources at MBB than our peers - or Pedon turns out to be a genius head and shoulders above the rest of the Valley - we should expect to be right there with the rest of the league, hoping and praying that things go our way and nobody important leaves or gets hurt.

 

[dpdoughbird06]

The game was as big of a diaperstain as the whole season; a semi-contained shitshow. We had a few bright spots, and were a handful of possessions away from 20 wins if you think about it, but in the end it is what it is...ANOTHER sub .500 season and first round exit in the Loo. It's going to be a neat trick to keep all of Chase, Johnny and Myles. If we do, that'll be a decent step for next year. We will be counting on two freshmen to contribute right away and Pence needs to take a big step. That's a recipe for more of the same unless we get lucky on a JUCO splash or two.

I dunno. I have no crystal ball, but this sucks, it continues to suck, and I hate watching every other team in the Valley...even the Almighty Valpo, leave us in the dust. I say Pedon has next year to either finish above .500 and/or win a game or two in STL or he's out. Then bring in a hungry, determined, no bullshit, Watch This type of guy who has a history of winning and building programs (I don't care the level.) The former player route doesn't work, minus a couple flashes in the pan. The hotshot assistant doesn't work, Jank was the last rodeo there. Find our Josh Schertz.

I’m sure there have been successful D2 HCs who moved up to this level and face planted, too. There’s no right answer when it comes to hiring a program leader.

The Valley has had successful a**holes (Wardle, Greggg) and sweethearts (Barry). Their backgrounds have varied and pretty much all of them have eventually lost their luster - even the mighty Jake is wearing out his extended stay in Frostbite Falls.

As we’ve seen with player movement, success is ever more fleeting today, and this so are absolutes in saying “we need ‘X’ type of coach” to win.

Anyway, sorry for the flood of five separate replies. Just sitting here on a couch in the Galleria watching my fiancé shop - which is what we’ve become accustomed to doing the last few years thanks to the Redbirds’ repeated Thursday exits.

Next year I’d like to have some adrenaline flowing on Friday or - dare I dream - all weekend long.

 

[Hamdonger]

The Valley has had successful a**holes (Wardle, Greggg) and sweethearts (Barry). Their backgrounds have varied and pretty much all of them have eventually lost their luster - even the mighty Jake is wearing out his extended stay in Frostbite Falls.

I got a kick of out this paragraph! If we had a King of KingA**hole...in the history of The Valley...who would win? Donewald has to be in consideration, don't you old timers think? Maybe not a winner, but a candidate...

 

[WoodlandWarrior]

Watching the games today.... it is disturbing how many teams are returning Good players and how many Valley teams are playing essentially underclassmen lineups. Barring injury or transfer those kids and those teams are back next year. We really have our work cut out for us just to be top 6 in the Valley. I don’t know if it can be done.

 

[dpdoughbird06]

I got a kick of out this paragraph! If we had a King of KingA**hole...in the history of The Valley...who would win? Donewald has to be in consideration, don't you old timers think? Maybe not a winner, but a candidate...

Another it-takes-all-kinds candidate: I was always partial to Marty Simmons with his sweater-vests and endless curls motion offense springing an elite shooter for endless midrange jumpers from the elbows, but he never really won anything.

But playing Evansville was always entertaining when he was around, which was more than we could say for last night.

 

[Aggie]

Top-four finishes in the Valley are not a big ask - until you have 12 fan bases saying and believing this. Everyone thinks they should be top tier every year, but the numbers game still says only a third ever will.

Unless we suddenly start throwing in far more resources at MBB than our peers - or Pedon turns out to be a genius head and shoulders above the rest of the Valley - we should expect to be right there with the rest of the league, hoping and praying that things go our way and nobody important leaves or gets hurt.

Right now I would settle to have the success of Northern Iowa

 

[ISU86]

Johnny.

The dominoes haven't begun to fall yet in the college basketball scene (sans Mullins). Johnny had a 6 game stretch where he was around 20 a game...IN A SUBSTANDARD OFFENSE, and as an overmatched guard.

He's very intelligent on the court - our highest IQ player jmo. He's very tough-minded despite getting his ass knocked around all year, and he has PROVEN that he can hit a shot almost anywhere on the court. He effectively gets to the paint better than any other guard we have. He also has a knack for knowing where to be on the court...in regards to a good shot or a good pass, or hek, even defensively in terms of knowing where to be. He came up with some BIG defensive plays for us. Last half of year he's in the argument for our best overall player on the team. Myles had better numbers - MUCH needed(!) - but Johnny makes those around him better. I'm not saying that with gaga eyes, either. It's realism.

DO NOT forget the ridiculous amount of woo'ing that goes on with programs bigger than ours. Once the dominoes start, you never know if a bigger program will find themselves with a gap that Johnny can fill. IMAGINE JOHNNY's IQ in a good offense...surrounded by better players. I'm not saying he's leaving. I think it's a better chance that he stays vs leaving. 80/20. I am saying...we are not safe, folks. While much room for improvement, I AM convinced he can play in a bigger program...and be successful. His size does hurt him, but his mind helps him. We don't need athletes, although that's nice. We need basketball players, and so does every other team. Johnny...is a basketball player.

We don't have much, currently, to woo with...other than relationships. And as we all know, or should know...that is MOST important and means everything - but in today's college basketball landscape, it doesn't seem to be worth sht. For every kid who is a pretty good player, you will be re-recruited every...single...year.

Expect Johnny to be recruited. Food for thought.

Nick Zeisloft went to Indiana. Jon Ekey went to Illinois. Both went to P5s and contributed (with lesser eligibility and statistics at ISU then Johnny Kinziger has now). I doubt many foresaw those.

Hoping it doesn't happen, but all it takes is that one opening ...