fourthandshort
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And played the entire NDSU game. Confusing but hiding an injury makes most sense .. especially concussion risk .. you dont want other team to know.
QB Competition update
- Thread starter ISUBU
- Start date
We put our opinions on the line here, but the coaches are the ones putting their jobs on the line. Bethard obviously sees something in Davis, so it's hard to argue with that. I also feel sorry for Jake, and was surprised he wasn't on the first team, but every position needs to be battled for every year. The race must be somewhat close, so the first time Davis gets rattled we will probably see Jake in there again. I think he'll get some opportunities to still shine this year, and you know he has the character to always be ready to go.
Hamdonger
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JHBird said:
Nice intro line!
The more I reflect on this and after seeing a whole lot more regarding Brady, the more excited I'm getting about the change (even though I anticipated Kolbe having a good year) Question is...can he quickly get up to speed...and...seems like a strange question but are our receivers up to the challenge of a dart thrower and risk-taker at the qb position?
Humdinger said:
I have a feeling Brady will hit a patch and throw some interceptions. Will the coaches then pull him or let him work it out? Playing QB is tough enough, but it's even more tough if you get pulled after a couple of mistakes. Nobody wants that hanging over their head, but when you got a super quality backup that's a senior, he almost then deserves a chance to come in. Playing multiple QB's this year isn't what anyone wants, but it's the situation we'll be facing. I'd rather have a sure starter and an up and comer to back him up, but oh well. It could be worse. We could have no good QB's. By the way, that Redshirt freshman QB passed the eye test with me. Can't wait to see how he develops under Bethard.
I have to believe that Kolbe's passing numbers might even be better than Davis' at seasons end....but my guess is that Kolbe has a rushing average somewhere between -1 and 2 yards per carry, while Davis will be in the 4 or 5 yards per carry range.
That is the difference. What Davis can and will do with his feet. I also bet our running backs average more yards per carry when he's in the game vs. when Kolbe is in the game.
That is the difference. What Davis can and will do with his feet. I also bet our running backs average more yards per carry when he's in the game vs. when Kolbe is in the game.
fourthandshort
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Generally agree, though Kolbe improved considerably in pocket from 2016 to 2017, despite our OC and fact that our OL slipped considerably. OL should be a strength this year .. I'd bet Kolbe's pocket decisions and run #s would improve considerably over a year ago.Chi-bird said:
That aside ... My guess is it will be very important for the team to embrace very high probability that we will come to rely on both Davis and Kolbe this season .. similar, though to lesser extent, that we shuld expect to rely on both RBs Robinson & Smith .. and IMO, Birch too. The fans and team should just embrace the reality of our situation. Obviously, I lean towards Kolbe still, but trust Beathard only because I do .. and because I get the logic of tapping into Davis potential from day 1 .. even though I think Kolbe earned the starting job. Davis may have better instincts in pocket, but Kolbe improved considerably in pocket from 2016 to 2017 .. even while his OL deteriorated considerably in 2017.
And I'll be honest .. if this were OC Dicken making this same decision, I would be ripping him to shreds because I firmly believe he was largely responsible for Kolbe getting worse from 2016 to 2017. But I trust Beathard to figure this out .. including if he decides he needs to platoon his QBs at times. I'm not a fan of platooning QBs but I think if you have 2 guys with different skill sets and our OC believes we can win with both, why not take advantage based on opponent or hot hand ... it will give opposing defenses more to game plan for. But need to keep that very positive .. I trust Beathard to handle this .. I would not feel same with Dicken.
Regardless, our offense is likely going to be very good this year .. the team needs to embrace strong possibility that we will rely on 2 QBs and as many as 3 RBs at times .. only need for 1 RB to get banged up here and there for BIrch to suddenly see 10-12 carries for 70 yards. WR remains a big question mark and variable ... if they become middle of road, that may be enough for this offense ... we are stacked deep everywhere else on offense this year.
Bottom line for me ... Offense should be very fun to watch this year .. rather than thinking of it as controversial or adversarial, I will simply embrace the depth. As I pointed out before, we have NOT had a viable 2nd string QB since 2009 .. let's take full advantage.
fourthandshort said:
I agree on Dicken, especially after hearing some of the stories on here. As a life-long blo-no native, the Dicken family, from my experience, carry themselves a certain way and will not hear anyone who tries to tell them to change something. That goes down to the BHS QB who had a chance to go to Purdue but got into some trouble, I digress.
I too am not a fan of ACTUALLY platooning QB's. But, there is an aspect of gamesmanship that I would do if I was Coach Spack. The St.X game will tell us practically nothing about what the team actually is. I assume we will see three, maybe 4 QB's take snaps if Jefferson isn't RS by that point. On second thought, with the new rule, freshmen can play 4 games and still be RS so we may see 4. The gamesmanship aspect could come into play for every game after that. Spack should, and likely will frame every week as a competition for QB1. "Jake is a 2-year starter and a senior, Davis does some other things well, so we'll see how it plays out." Nothing wrong with keeping teams on their toes. He did that a bit last season not knowing if Jake was going to play due to injury or what have you. I am excited for football! 8 more days! But just remember the STX game won't show us anything. I'd be surprised if we run more than 8 plays. Should be a nice tune up leading into the Mid-America Classic.
Hamdonger
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After seeing Davis...he's got a better gun (and he gets it out quick, man) and he's going to move better.
Kolbe's got the ISU protocol and experience, obviously, and I like him. But it's hard to ignore that arm and those legs.
Again, I feel pretty optimistic about our QB situation. And as much as I want to see Kolbe have a great senior year, I just can't buy into a platoon situation. They named Davis the starter. At this point it's his job to lose.
But Jake...stay ready.
Kolbe's got the ISU protocol and experience, obviously, and I like him. But it's hard to ignore that arm and those legs.
Again, I feel pretty optimistic about our QB situation. And as much as I want to see Kolbe have a great senior year, I just can't buy into a platoon situation. They named Davis the starter. At this point it's his job to lose.
But Jake...stay ready.
fourthandshort
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Platooning QB position can work in situations so long as coaches handle properly. And so long as it does not become adversarial and divides the team .. even coaches. Do that thru communication and overtly game planning. And by not treating it as "benching" one or the other. Each guy and the team should know the general plan. And when one is having a bad day, treat it like a simple pitching change ... "not your day, but stay ready".
But if one or the other is clearly outperforming, then you make 5hat decision if needed by mid season ... just no controversy by playoff time. But keep it positive and it can work.
But if one or the other is clearly outperforming, then you make 5hat decision if needed by mid season ... just no controversy by playoff time. But keep it positive and it can work.
StLRedbird
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4th, that’s a good point about trusting Beathards judgement over Dickens. Would agree w that, but I remember thinking in 2015 - more than once - should we be letting Roberson’s hand heal completely? Kolbe seemed up to the job even as a RS freshman
Virginia Redbird
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Two QB's that can start and win games for you...poor Coach Spack! What a dilemma, huh?
fourthandshort
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fourthandshort said:
I know I've talked out of both sides of my mouth on this topic .. most times, I strongly prefer to go with 1 QB for entire season. But this situation is a little unique. if we platoon for 4 or 5 weeks, and one guy proves he clearly gives us best chance to win, then coaches need to make that decision .. I would prefer around week 5 in MVFC home opener against WIU. But if both are having their moments and both can help us win ... make it work, just keep it positive with the QBs and entire team.
Assume for moment we wind up platooning QB and rotating RBs all season .. here are the clips I most want to see:
- Brady (or Kolbe) slinging a 60 yard TD pass; then Kolbe (or Brady) running onto field after play to high five Brady (or Kolbe)
- Robinson (or Smith or Birch) breaking 3 tackles and running for 40 yard TD, with Smith (and/or Birch and/or Robinson) running onto field after play to high 5 Robinson (or Smith or Birch).
That is what this offense's attitude should look like ... where everyone is rooting for each other to make plays, and noone is thinking about QB starting position as controversy. Then if defense finds itself, we'll be watching our Redbirds play some playoff games this fall.
fourthandshort said:
Platooning is tough because you cannot be predictable with it, which is hard to do. For example, last time when we were platooning: When Jake was in, he was likely throwing or giving the ball to Smith/Robinson. When Malachi was in, it was read-option and he was keeping it most of the time. That is just common knowledge. The key is if you do platoon, have them run some of the same plays. Obviously, Davis will be more likely to run, but you can't let that be an every time thing.
TIMMY
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Everyone should play against St. X. After that splitting reps in games means splitting reps in practice. Davis needs all the reps he can get. Cut his reps and you cut his productivity. Should Tre have split his practice reps? Not in my opinion. And don't forget the 20 hour rule.
#2 is a great kid. I get it. But this is athletics.
#2 is a great kid. I get it. But this is athletics.
btw Coach Spack is saying that Davis will likely qualify for a medical redshirt and have 3 years of eligibility as a Redbird.
TIMMY
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Thanks TR. That's awesome. I'm really jacked about this kid.Total Red said:
fourthandshort
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Total Red said:
this is huge ... this takes us past RBs Robinson & Smith graduation after 2019 and ensures 2020 has promise ... wow .. huge, if it happens !!
Bet the over on 2019 .. planets are aligning on both sides of ball. But don't yet bet the under on 2020 .. QB Davis and RB Birch are enough. Still have high hopes for 2018 .. but it will depend on how quickly this big defense finds itself.
Defense ... find yourself !!!