Poll: Keeping Muller

[dpdoughbird06]

I just noticed that this season has turned me into an “Active Member” on RBF. @isuquinndog for how long do I have to go dormant again before I can return to “Casual Lurker” status?

 

[Redbirdfan06]

Muller is not Barb Smith. Yes, you can definitely find a coach for less than $550k. But we’d still be paying Muller his $600k, too. And a new coach won’t increase attendance, if the current Valley-wide dip continues.

Might as well give him until at least part of the way into the final year since our program still has hope; it shouldn’t even hurt recruiting, since everyone is a free agent these days anyway.

What proof do we have that a new coach wouldn’t increase attendance? We have proof that our current coach isn’t. Why get rid of coach mid year next season? You get rid of a coach mid season, that means you have zero confidence going into that season with him.

 

[jwa123]

I agree, Jerry. If not for the contract, we’d all be on the same page that it’d be time for all parties to move on. But Redbird Athletics is like the family on a tight budget that can’t just go buy a new car when the old one breaks down. Make the repairs that get you by and ride it out until you’ve saved up enough dough to invest in something new.

And who knows - maybe the old minivan surprisingly discovers a second life and keeps on chugging.

*Barb Smith was the WBB coach before Kristen Gillespie came in and turned it around. Under her tenure the Redbirds went from competing for NCAA bids to perennial Valley doormat. That’s why I say Muller is not Barb Smith.

Oh I see your point and it’s not lost on me. To further add to your point, I’d be surprised if the assistants are not on contracts so those would have to be bought out as well. What I wonder is what is the opportunity cost of lost revenue from shrinking attendance in comparison to a bloated salary?

If we ever get those numbers we will sit together with an excel spreadsheet and adroitly calculate the numbers to come up with the answer.

 

[Adunk33]

The announcers were MVC guys. They do the weekly game on the MVC Sports Network (Bally Sports, formally Fox Sports (regional- Midwest, KC, Indiana, etc.). The PBP guy, Scott Warman hosts STL Cardinals Pregame and used to, and still may do a lot with the MVC tournament.

 

[Bird Friend]

Eight pages in . . .

 

[Birdfriend72]

How can he earn it if we let him go?

He had 10 years to earn it. You don’t continue to keep your job if you aren’t profitable? It’s ok that he isn’t successful- but it’s time to move on. You act as though he is getting the raw end of the stick here. It’s not like he is a newcomer! I can separate the HOF player from the failed coach. Hopefully you can too!

 

[Bird Friend]

He had 10 years to earn it. You don’t continue to keep your job if you aren’t profitable? It’s ok that he isn’t successful- but it’s time to move on. You act as though he is getting the raw end of the stick here. It’s not like he is a newcomer! I can separate the HOF player from the failed coach. Hopefully you can too!

Actually, he was asking the question based on exactly what you said, not what you meant. You said, “DISAGREE! He has been given enough. It’s time for him to earn it. Time to go.”

 

[Birdfriend72]

Actually, he was asking the question based on exactly what you said, not what you meant. You said, “DISAGREE! He has been given enough. It’s time for him to earn it. Time to go.”

He hasn’t earned it. If you think he has you don’t care about this program!

 

[RedbirdFanatic32]

He hasn’t earned it. If you think he has you don’t care about this program!

Is this an Abbott and Costello routine?

 

[Bird Friend]

Is this an Abbott and Costello routine?

Only the guy on first base knows why BF72 can't understand why he was asked the question.

 

[BirdGrad2011]

Dan Muller’s record the last 4 seasons (toss out this years 10-10 for direct comparison) are worse than Tom Richardson or Porter Moser’s 4 year runs.

I don’t see enough wins to change that by replacing the 2017-18 season with this year. Either way the precedent is set. 4 years of this shit gets you canned.

 

[ISU86]

Only the guy on first base knows why BF72 can't understand why he was asked the question.

I lost interest when 72 essentially compared the Illinois State coffers to that of the Chicago Bears (who are valued at over four billion dollars). I think the Bears may have just a little more financial flexibility to hire and fire as they see fit.

 

[gobirds85]

Dan Muller’s record the last 4 seasons (toss out this years 10-10 for direct comparison) are worse than Tom Richardson or Porter Moser’s 4 year runs.

I don’t see enough wins to change that by replacing the 2017-18 season with this year. Either way the precedent is set. 4 years of this shit gets you canned.

You spelled Richarson wrong. There was no D here when he coached. I never thought we’d return to that level, and yet...here we are.

 

[Birdfriend72]

I lost interest when 72 essentially compared the Illinois State coffers to that of the Chicago Bears (who are valued at over four billion dollars). I think the Bears may have just a little more financial flexibility to hire and fire as they see fit.

If you can’t see it wasn’t about the money. It was about the fact that Nagy had one good season like your savior Dan. Unfortunately, Dan hasn’t done anything since!

 

[Redbird60451]

I think we should promote him. I'm not saying more money, but a change in title. See it all the time, it might be cheaper than the buy out. There has to be a position above Head Coach, but below AD, like maybe team President? General Manager? I don't know what duties he'd have, but just thinking outside the box, since financially it doesn't make sense for ISU to spend student fee's on buying him out.

The donations are not going down, they are just being funneled to the football bubble, which I think they are getting ripped off on. Bo Jackson has one of those domes by me, thing is constantly filled with kids practicing football/baseball/softball. And Robert Morris college uses it and put their big logo off the side right off 355 so everyone can see it. Should have some sort of Private industry come in and build it, and just pay them rent, so we can walk away from it when it becomes out of date. It will be cheaper in the long run, unless after 5 pm you plan to rent it out to every travel baseball team/travel softball team/pee wee football team, and make money off of it. You know it will stay more up to date if private industry runs it, because they are out to make money. The university will do minimum necessary to keep it useable.

 

[Birdfriend72]

I think we should promote him. I'm not saying more money, but a change in title. See it all the time, it might be cheaper than the buy out. There has to be a position above Head Coach, but below AD, like maybe team President? General Manager? I don't know what duties he'd have, but just thinking outside the box, since financially it doesn't make sense for ISU to spend student fee's on buying him out.

The donations are not going down, they are just being funneled to the football bubble, which I think they are getting ripped off on. Bo Jackson has one of those domes by me, thing is constantly filled with kids practicing football/baseball/softball. And Robert Morris college uses it and put their big logo off the side right off 355 so everyone can see it. Should have some sort of Private industry come in and build it, and just pay them rent, so we can walk away from it when it becomes out of date. It will be cheaper in the long run, unless after 5 pm you plan to rent it out to every travel baseball team/travel softball team/pee wee football team, and make money off of it. You know it will stay more up to date if private industry runs it, because they are out to make money. The university will do minimum necessary to keep it useable.

Actually, not a bad idea. Instead demote him. Keep him on payroll and add one of the assistants as head coach- or like you said make him the director of basketball operations. Hire a young high school coach for a two years.

 

[ISU86]

If you can’t see it wasn’t about the money. It was about the fact that Nagy had one good season like your savior Dan. Unfortunately, Dan hasn’t done anything since!

I simply referenced that access to surplus money is a difference, but (of course) you need to spin that into supporting Dan. Classic offensive move, to re-frame the discussion and put someone else on the defense.

Where does the actual money come from, without an answer being "we cannot afford not to"?

 

[Birdfriend72]

I simply referenced that access to surplus money is a difference, but (of course) you need to spin that into supporting Dan. Classic offensive move, to re-frame the discussion and put someone else on the defense.

Where does the actual money come from, without an answer being "we cannot afford not to"?

There isn't any spinning. It's simple- keep him on payroll and demote him. If you think he deserves a promotion that's fine. I am not going to use the word promotion for a guy that deserves to be terminated. Believe it or not many believe he is paid to win basketball games. They also believe he has failed at that. The poll says 50-27 that he should be winning.

What extra money? An assistant is promoted to Dan spot- and Dan is reassigned. It's no different than a VP'S job is being done away with...and you reassign that person to an underwriting position.

 

[DWRedbird]

I think we should promote him. I'm not saying more money, but a change in title. See it all the time, it might be cheaper than the buy out. There has to be a position above Head Coach, but below AD, like maybe team President? General Manager? I don't know what duties he'd have, but just thinking outside the box, since financially it doesn't make sense for ISU to spend student fee's on buying him out.

The donations are not going down, they are just being funneled to the football bubble, which I think they are getting ripped off on. Bo Jackson has one of those domes by me, thing is constantly filled with kids practicing football/baseball/softball. And Robert Morris college uses it and put their big logo off the side right off 355 so everyone can see it. Should have some sort of Private industry come in and build it, and just pay them rent, so we can walk away from it when it becomes out of date. It will be cheaper in the long run, unless after 5 pm you plan to rent it out to every travel baseball team/travel softball team/pee wee football team, and make money off of it. You know it will stay more up to date if private industry runs it, because they are out to make money. The university will do minimum necessary to keep it useable.

I don't think it would be cheaper than buying him out. We'd hire another coach, and assuming we do it on the cheap with some no-name coach at 250k a year, we are looking at roughly 850k per year to keep Muller, and instead of paying roughly 1,200,000 to get rid of Muller you'd spend roughly 1,700,000 to keep him.

 

[SgtHulka]

There isn't any spinning. It's simple- keep him on payroll and demote him. If you think he deserves a promotion that's fine. I am not going to use the word promotion for a guy that deserves to be terminated. Believe it or not many believe he is paid to win basketball games. They also believe he has failed at that. The poll says 50-27 that he should be winning.

What extra money? An assistant is promoted to Dan spot- and Dan is reassigned. It's no different than a VP'S job is being done away with...and you reassign that person to an underwriting position.

You really need to spend more time figuring out which argument you are having with which person.