Norfolk St- Horton Game

[ISU FAN 1]

Message from the President…..

A message from Interim President Tarhule, December 12, 2023

As many of you are aware, the men’s basketball game on Saturday, December 9, between Illinois State University and Norfolk State University was regrettably marred by the report of a racial slur directed at a Norfolk State player by an Illinois State fan.

news.illinoisstate.edu

 

[ISU FAN 1]

 

[Seven]

I don’t recognize the name, but then he also says the ISU player said it didn’t happen. Jordan Davis would’ve been closest. He looked so confused in that moment too. I wonder what he heard if anything.

What Dakich says is consistent with the "Butler Blue" post Monday morning on the other Bradley board that "I've been told a non-fan has an account that does not at all support the claim". It's an anonymous poster so always take it with a grain of salt, but that guy has consistently posted accurate inside information on administrative things at Bradley and across the MVC.

We'll see.

 

[CaliRdBrd]

Sounds like a man who is loving his 15 minutes. The fact that he didn’t take Pedon’s call is cowardly.

 

[Redbird222]

About the statement or the post-game presser? I think you're probably right about the written statement. IMO, the press conference is solely the fault of the athletics department.

I dont think this is just on the athletic department. Here is some of what Pedon said at the post game press conference

“I was upset he was on the floor, and I was raising hell with the referees. It was never personal towards him. I’ll just leave it at that. I’ll take the high road on that,” Pedon said.

“I’m a competitor, man. I’m an Italian, so sometimes my emotions can get the best of me at times, but I don’t apologize for my competitive edge and that’s how I want our teams to play,” Pedon continued.

Does this sound like someone who was advised not to say anything about the incident? If that was the advice ... why say thise things. Do you think that the athletic department told him to say that? Those are his words.

It sounds more like someone who was not informed that there were accusations of a racial slur. Perhaps that is the case but once again how did he not know that? Norfolk coach said he tried to tell him while shaking hands, the referees never told coaching staff even though they took time to tell TV announcers. And the administration/athletic department didn't tell him either. Grad2011 says Pedon tried to apologize while shaking hands. I may have missed but I had not seen that anywhere. If he did tey to apologize and knew about allegations why would he say what he did in post game?

I have no issue how Pedon responded on court except he should have voiced his complaint to the referees instead of getting into a heated battle with the opposing coach. He clearly didn't know what was transpiring in that moment. My issue is what he said in the post game and I hold him and the athletic department accountable. His only excuse would be he still didn't know there were racial slur accusations happening when he did the post game show. I just find that hard to believe.

 

[BirdGrad2011]

Grad2011 says Pedon tried to apologize while shaking hands. I may have missed but I had not seen that anywhere. If he did tey to apologize and knew about allegations why would he say what he did in post game?

I have no issue how Pedon responded on court except he should have voiced his complaint to the referees instead of getting into a heated battle with the opposing coach. He clearly didn't know what was transpiring in that moment. My issue is what he said in the post game and I hold him and the athletic department accountable. His only excuse would be he still didn't know there were racial slur accusations happening when he did the post game show. I just find that hard to believe.

He may have been told to not bring up the potential racial comment. ISU was probably going a bit too conservative to not throw anyone under the bus without proof and open up any potential lawsuits. Either way. He was told to handle it a certain way and did so. I fully support him.

 

[Redbird]

How come I feel like Jones’ is just making sh@t up?

Because he is. The kid made up that it happened, the coach is making up that the ref heard it. All of this truth is going to come out. There will be people that will never believe the truth and thats fine but the fans never said anything of a racial nature and there are witnesses and the refs never told the coach that they heard it as well.

 

[isuquinndog]

I think it's somewhere in between. I'm sure Jones is taking this way further than what happened (at least with the fan). But I'm also pretty sure that the fan didn't say "Hey I hope you have a nice day".

Hey fans, quit interacting with opposing players. Nothing good is going to come out of it.

 

[Reggie1857]

How come I feel like Jones’ is just making sh@t up?

The more you peel back this onion, the more Jesse Smollety it smells.

 

[ISU FAN 1]

Just going to wait for ISU to interview the refs, the TV announcers, and any surrounding fans, and assess the credibility of findings from the investigation. Hopefully witnesses are truthful and without motive to cover anything up.

 

[BirdGrad2011]

I just hate that ISU is being drug through the mud for something that nobody has confirmed yet. We got no name accounts attacking players and coaches over what a fan might have said. One said they were going to go outside of Maddox’s school and yell slurs at him. This is insanity.

 

[DougSutton]

Because he is. The kid made up that it happened, the coach is making up that the ref heard it. All of this truth is going to come out. There will be people that will never believe the truth and thats fine but the fans never said anything of a racial nature and there are witnesses and the refs never told the coach that they heard it as well.

That's a bold statement that I believe we all want to believe. I'm curious how you came to this conclusion. So far, we have a head coach who we all know by name specifically saying that a ref (who I'm sure has been interviewed since the incident) told him this comment. As much as I want to believe that the comment was never made, if I'm being objective in observing these two opposing claims, at this point, the NSU coach is more credible because he put his name to this statement. If he lied, as you are claiming, the ref would have (or will) deny ever making that comment.

Now, if you are willing to disclose your name and specifically why you made this claim including the names of the people that were at the game that are corroborating your claim, your credibility increases. Otherwise, making claims like this behind an anonymous screen name comes across as an internet troll.

 

[BirdGrad2011]

That's a bold statement that I believe we all want to believe. I'm curious how you came to this conclusion. So far, we have a head coach who we all know by name specifically saying that a ref (who I'm sure has been interviewed since the incident) told him this comment. As much as I want to believe that the comment was never made, if I'm being objective in observing these two opposing claims, at this point, the NSU coach is more credible because he put his name to this statement. If he lied, as you are claiming, the ref would have (or will) deny ever making that comment.

Now, if you are willing to disclose your name and specifically why you made this claim including the names of the people that were at the game that are corroborating your claim, your credibility increases. Otherwise, making claims like this behind an anonymous screen name comes across as an internet troll.

One thing you are missing. Jones never heard the comment. He said his player told him. He says the ref heard it. Did the ref hear or did he hear the player say it? It was so loud as this unfolded that we know the coaches had a misunderstanding. I don’t think anyone that didn’t hear the alleged comment had a true, full understanding.

 

[DougSutton]

I just hate that ISU is being drug through the mud for something that nobody has confirmed yet. We got no name accounts attacking players and coaches over what a fan might have said. One said they were going to go outside of Maddox’s school and yell slurs at him. This is insanity.

Completely agree. No one should draw definitive conclusions however as I've said before, I am choosing to take the NSU coach's word regarding what the ref told him. I have 100% trust that the ISU administration will do a full investigation and transparently disclose the findings.

One thing I hate about internet message boards and social media apps are no name/anonymous accounts that make attacking claims toward anyone and regardless of what "side" someone is on, no one should ever make attacking statements or use inflammatory language about another person, especially while hiding behind a screen name and being unwilling to put their actual name to their statement.

 

[DougSutton]

One thing you are missing. Jones never heard the comment. He said his player told him. He says the ref heard it. Did the ref hear or did he hear the player say it? It was so loud as this unfolded that we know the coaches had a misunderstanding. I don’t think anyone that didn’t hear the alleged comment had a true, full understanding.

If I'm missing that then I apologize. I could have sworn I read a quote or heard (watched) video from their coach specifically saying that the ref heard the quote and that is what triggered him to be upset. IF that is what happened, I completely understand being upset and go back to placing the ultimate blame on that ref for not bringing both coaches together to say this.

 

[BirdGrad2011]

If I'm missing that then I apologize. I could have sworn I read a quote or heard (watched) video from their coach specifically saying that the ref heard the quote and that is what triggered him to be upset. IF that is what happened, I completely understand being upset and go back to placing the ultimate blame on that ref for not bringing both coaches together to say this.

I think he said the ref heard it, but no clarity on if the ref heard the comment or heard it from the player. If the ref heard the comment that should end speculation. Punish the fan (ban), learn and grow. If the ref didn’t hear it but heard from the player then that is where speculation runs wild. I don’t think it was said, but I’m not closing that door in my mind until we get more answers.

I want to think all ISU fans are better than that. As every single one of us has said. Racism has no place at ISU or in our society.

 

[Shaftbird]

Maybe I'm off base, but I just would think that if the ref directly heard the comment from the fan, especially if it was as blatantly racially-charged as some of the allegations, the ref would have immediately gone over to either the fan or security and had that fan removed. In real time, it was a few minutes after the verbal engagement between Thomas and the fan before they were removed from courtside. And even then, they sat in the south bleachers for a couple minutes behind the bleachers, and later were standing on the upper concourse of the west bleachers watching for awhile. There didn't seem to be real urgency to removing them from the premises.

 

[BirdGrad2011]

The non reaction from 6 or the ref immediately is my biggest question.

 

[Rollbirds5]

The non reaction from 6 or the ref immediately is my biggest question.

Everyone acts to situations differently and very possible it was shocking to #6 if he heard what’s being alleged and that’s why there’s no response, just weird to me that he was trash talking and at times taunting the fans most of the game and then no response at all to something as bad as what’s been allegedly said. If it’s all true I would commend him for handling it like he did and letting the ref/coach handle it and not be violent in the face of hateful language, he’d be a better person than most in that situation

 

[stielowp]

That's a bold statement that I believe we all want to believe. I'm curious how you came to this conclusion. So far, we have a head coach who we all know by name specifically saying that a ref (who I'm sure has been interviewed since the incident) told him this comment. As much as I want to believe that the comment was never made, if I'm being objective in observing these two opposing claims, at this point, the NSU coach is more credible because he put his name to this statement. If he lied, as you are claiming, the ref would have (or will) deny ever making that comment.

Now, if you are willing to disclose your name and specifically why you made this claim including the names of the people that were at the game that are corroborating your claim, your credibility increases. Otherwise, making claims like this behind an anonymous screen name comes across as an internet troll.

I am not trusting the comments by the coach based on what I observed. I was sitting behind the visitor bench across from the incident.

1. Foul is called on Davis for a reach (or block) on #6. Crowd erupted in boos from the ticky-tack foul.
2. #6 went directly toward fans on floor seats and interacted with them
3. Closest referee gathers with the NSU team and starts to talk to them. #6 gets defensive (but not angry) - more like a "what about them"
4. NSU Coach starts to move onto the Court to talk to the referee.
5. Pedon gets upset and starts yelling at referees and Coach
6. NSU Coach starts to return to his own bench, sees and hears Pedon and responds, then walks toward Pedon
7. Pedon and NSU Coach start yelling and chest bumping.
8. Referees and players work to break up coaches.
9. Review by the officials. Double Tech's assigned to coaches.

The reason why I don't believe a "racial slur" was said, is because of the reaction of the players #6 and Davis (who were the closest). Also, the referee doesn't react how I would believe he would, had he heard a racial slur. I would have expected a stronger reaction from players and referee if a racial slur was said. I also believe that Pedon had no knowledge of the accusation of a racial slur until after the game and before the press conference. I don't believe he knew the accusation until at earliest the meeting with the NSU Coach after the handshake line. I think at that time, is when Pedon may have found out.

I think this story has been embellished by NSU now that they have been getting some attention about it, and I believe they are taking advantage of it. ISU is in a bad situation regardless. If the investigation finds something different, then I will accept it, but until I hear differently, I can only go by what I saw.