Indiana State - 01/04/2023 - 7:00 PM - ESPN+

radik

Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2017
Messages
58
We have a parent of a player on the board questioning the game plan! Illinois State has become a bottom third basketball program in the country.
Woah, I guess we really have to pack it in and start over if a parent of a player is questioning things!

If there is one thing I have learned from both travel ball and the recent USMNT soccer drama, its that sports parents are almost always right and usually purely team motivated...

(BTW SlackBooDom, I do agree with the sentiment of the rest of your post)
 

Adunk33

Well-known member
Staff member
Joined
Jul 21, 2017
Messages
10,003
Is Benson and the Vidette the only media in these press conferences? We need some more media in there to ask questions.
Just a reminder Pedon does to a post game interview with the radio broadcast where he is asked some different stuff. That one is just very difficult to find on-demand, so hear it live or miss it forever. The full audio broadcast is on Goredbirds but it is very glitchy and makes the interviews damn near impossible to listen to. Kelly Burke and Kurt Peglar sometimes go in to the post game presser when they are on the broadcast. Though, it doesn't appear they did that last night.
 

Adunk33

Well-known member
Staff member
Joined
Jul 21, 2017
Messages
10,003
As for the game...man it was bad. Pedon mentioned pregame that Indy State would be a team that scores in the paint...to a casual fan with nowhere near the basketball knowledge of someone who has been in the industry for 25 years... It would've made sense to me to start out in a zone. Cut out some of the lanes and eliminate switching 1 through 5. Too many times Burford, Sandage, and Poindexter were put in bad situations getting bodied down low. The help side guy would come over (usually too late) and his guy cuts to the basket for an easy lay up.

Glad to see they had fight in the second half but being at the game, it felt a little more like Indy State backing off versus the Birds playing completely better, though they were more competitive. The slow starts are maddening but Pedon has shown the ability to make adjustments at halftime. Noticeably, they stopped switching on every screen and eliminated Burford having to go 1v1 against guys 7-10 inches taller and 80lbs heavier.

I'll keep saying it, this team can win games. The fight is there, effort is for about 75% of the time. A key to success is going to be at the foul line. They don't have anyone on the team that is a consistent scorer. A player which they can give the ball and just say go. Create your own opportunities and do not shy away from the contact at the bucket. Once again, last night they would get in solid position by driving to the hole and then too many times would either kick out, or jump stop, turn and shoot a post fadeaway. Go up strong and get to the foul line. 8-11 last night.

The bad news is, the losses keep coming and getting down double digits and trying to come back isn't a sustainable way to win games. The good news is they don't just lay down. Teams of the past 5 years probably lose by 20 last night because they'd be so dejected and hang their heads. I think getting away from RBA this weekend will help take some pressure off, similarly to going to NW State and EIU. Another very winnable game in a couple days.

Any superstitious people out there...the Birds "traditional" home whites and red road uni's have been bad for this year. Throw em in the trash and go with the "retro white" at home, black on the road, and gray as the alt.
 

TIMMY

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 17, 2017
Messages
5,450
Location
1050 W Addison
What’s the reason behind coming out so dang slow? I don’t understand that at all, mind blowing
I had a team like this before. I made them go live 10 minutes before kickoff. They about crapped their drawers. We never came out slow after that. You gotta do SOMETHING! You gotta wake them up. You can't just sit there and watch.
 

Redbirdfan06

Active member
Joined
Nov 25, 2017
Messages
498
Stop waiting for official tv timeouts and call one yourself. The team didn’t have it when they came out after the tip and Indiana state pounced on us. Call a timeout and try to stop any more momentum.
 

BTbird

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 16, 2017
Messages
1,291
I did not see the game but when I went to check on the score, there was like 8:00 left in the first half, InSt had 30 points and was shooting 81.3%. That is an insane shooting percentage for being that far in the game.
 

DoubleDeuce

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 18, 2017
Messages
2,680
Interior passing of Indy state was outstanding.
They would penetrate the lane and get a guy free crossing for easy pass and scores. Too often it seemed when our guards drove they are stuck in no-man's land struggling to get the ball passed out or spinning a prayer off the backboard.
 

Matt Hein Fan

Active member
Joined
Mar 3, 2018
Messages
179
How does this help us get any better for the future? Wouldn't this mean Pedon's entire first year is a wash? He got some game management experience and knows what he doesn't want, but needs all new assistant coaches and players. Next year we have a brand new program again and if that doesn't go well we say he can lose everyone and try again in year three.

Our only meaningful win this year is against Belmont. We lost at home to Western Illinois and Northwestern State. Indiana State just led for 38+ minutes on the road against us. Illinois State ranks worse analytically than it did every year under Dan Muller by a wide margin. We have a parent of a player on the board questioning the game plan! Illinois State has become a bottom third basketball program in the country.
What are you realistically getting from this team if you bring the majority of it back next year? No clear culture has been established yet nor have the results on the court been good. In today’s age of college hoops bad teams should be attempting to reload every year until they get it right. I’m confident in Pedon being able to do this but if you only open up 3-4 scholarships I think we see more of the same next season and that’s unacceptable.
 

davehead86

Member
Joined
Jul 20, 2017
Messages
31
I walked out of the arena last night feeling pretty hopeless. I’m just not seeing any signs that this season is going to get better. Indiana State was by far the better team. Quick, efficient and knew what they wanted to do. I’ll say again; I don’t blame Pedon; yet.
This makes no sense to me. I walked out dissappointed in the loss but energized about the teams ability to fight back and stay in the game in the second half. INSU is clearly the team to beat right now in the Valley. They have been behind for a total of 6 MINUTES in their last five games. Thats an ungodly statistic, and shooting 80% FG for the majority of the first half. Those numbers are insane.

I dont understand how people are this down and ready to start bailing on the players and the coach after 15 games. Did yall think this was gonna be an instant NCAA berth team? Really? Was that your expectation going into this year?
 

davehead86

Member
Joined
Jul 20, 2017
Messages
31
What are you realistically getting from this team if you bring the majority of it back next year? No clear culture has been established yet nor have the results on the court been good. In today’s age of college hoops bad teams should be attempting to reload every year until they get it right. I’m confident in Pedon being able to do this but if you only open up 3-4 scholarships I think we see more of the same next season and that’s unacceptable.
You dont establish a culture by reloading half the team every year because you didnt like how many points they put up in a rebuilding season. We are not UNC, we dont have the luxury of baiting major recruits out of the transfer portal. We get kids and develop them and hopefully they stick around with us for 4-5 years. Thats how a mid major runs. Did yall forget this?
 

DoubleDeuce

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 18, 2017
Messages
2,680
I dont understand how people are this down and ready to start bailing on the players and the coach after 15 games. Did yall think this was gonna be an instant NCAA berth team? Really? Was that your expectation going into this year?
I don't think anyone is bailing on anyone. Normal post loss venting and analysis. I've noticed that most people on this board will support the coaches and team we put on the court but willing to offer constructive criticism as they see fit.
 
P

Popsto4

Guest
How does this help us get any better for the future? Wouldn't this mean Pedon's entire first year is a wash? He got some game management experience and knows what he doesn't want, but needs all new assistant coaches and players. Next year we have a brand new program again and if that doesn't go well we say he can lose everyone and try again in year three.

Our only meaningful win this year is against Belmont. We lost at home to Western Illinois and Northwestern State. Indiana State just led for 38+ minutes on the road against us. Illinois State ranks worse analytically than it did every year under Dan Muller by a wide margin. We have a parent of a player on the board questioning the game plan! Illinois State has become a bottom third basketball program in the country.
This might sound crazy but I’m saying 1True Player and and a true PG and this season would be real different this year. I don’t question the system in a negative way at all. I’m just wondering why the slow starts actually. Turnovers with the slow starts put us in the hole too early and often in games. I see and hear the frustration but man can I see improvements going into next year too with much needed position upgrades.
 

cubird

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 19, 2017
Messages
2,389
You dont establish a culture by reloading half the team every year because you didnt like how many points they put up in a rebuilding season. We are not UNC, we dont have the luxury of baiting major recruits out of the transfer portal. We get kids and develop them and hopefully they stick around with us for 4-5 years. Thats how a mid major runs. Did yall forget this?
That's how mid majors use to build teams. Now you develop a player and he looks for a better NIL deal. U have to develop a system to plug and play with new transfers every year. We have an old experienced team, but no one transferring up to a P5.
 

Redbird222

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 18, 2017
Messages
5,381
This might sound crazy but I’m saying 1True Player and and a true PG and this season would be real different this year. I don’t question the system in a negative way at all. I’m just wondering why the slow starts actually. Turnovers with the slow starts put us in the hole too early and often in games. I see and hear the frustration but man can I see improvements going into next year too with much needed position upgrades.
A true PG and good front line player would make a big difference. Not only do you get their production and increased depth, but other players can contribute more by playing their natural positions.

We have 3 2023 freshman recruits that are filling the current open scholarship and Sandage/Knight' scholarship who are out of eligibility. I think (and hope) there will be 2 to 4 scholarships available in addition to these. I don't think it is in the interest of the team or those players to stay at ISU if not any significant playing time is expected in the future. If we retain 6 to 8 scholarship players plus 1 or 2 walkons we can maintain and continue to grow the culture that Pedon is trying to establish.
 
P

Popsto4

Guest
Woah, I guess we really have to pack it in and start over if a parent of a player is questioning things!

If there is one thing I have learned from both travel ball and the recent USMNT soccer drama, its that sports parents are almost always right and usually purely team motivated...

(BTW SlackBooDom, I do agree with the sentiment of the rest of your post)
Nothing else to talk about other than a parent, come on man. I’m not selfish and don’t tel Mal to be selfish either as you can tell by his play. I will say he pass up way too many shots though honestly.
 

Matt Hein Fan

Active member
Joined
Mar 3, 2018
Messages
179
You dont establish a culture by reloading half the team every year because you didnt like how many points they put up in a rebuilding season. We are not UNC, we dont have the luxury of baiting major recruits out of the transfer portal. We get kids and develop them and hopefully they stick around with us for 4-5 years. Thats how a mid major runs. Did yall forget this?
The year is 2023, this no longer applies in today’s transfer portal whereas it was probably true a decade ago. If you recruit a great player and he plays great, he’s bolting to the highest bidder (power 5 more then likely) whenever he first can. And not having to sit out a season anymore is the main accelerator.
 

DaveBird10

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 17, 2017
Messages
1,396
The year is 2023, this no longer applies in today’s transfer portal whereas it was probably true a decade ago. If you recruit a great player and he plays great, he’s bolting to the highest bidder (power 5 more then likely) whenever he first can. And not having to sit out a season anymore is the main accelerator.
Well the 2 teams currently leading the conference right now in Indiana State and SIU the two leaders of those schools have been in the MVC for their entire careers with Cooper Neese at Indiana State and Marcus Domask at SIU. I know Cooper Neese isn't the Indiana State leading scorer but he is the leader of that team and still scores more then 10ppg, so some schools have figured out how to do it and how to keep the players at their current schools.
 
P

Popsto4

Guest
This makes no sense to me. I walked out dissappointed in the loss but energized about the teams ability to fight back and stay in the game in the second half. INSU is clearly the team to beat right now in the Valley. They have been behind for a total of 6 MINUTES in their last five games. Thats an ungodly statistic, and shooting 80% FG for the majority of the first half. Those numbers are insane.

I dont understand how people are this down and ready to start bailing on the players and the coach after 15 games. Did yall think this was gonna be an instant NCAA berth team? Really? Was that your expectation going into this year?
As with any sports team the younger teams usually lose the close games. This team have playing experience but very little to none coming into the season. So this is not o Ly a new team but a young one also. With the kids returning who I think will, new recruits and a transfer or maybe two the program will definitely head in the right direction. It’s frustrating as a fan and dad of a player but still I see some improvement event before the help arrive.
 

TIMMY

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 17, 2017
Messages
5,450
Location
1050 W Addison
2 5th year, 2 Grad Students, 2 Seniors, 3 RS Juniors, 6 Juniors, O Sophs, O Frosh. 12 Games played. A young team? There's nothing young about this group in any way. This is the new face of college basketball. Play better. They should be coming out of the locker room with a fire lit under their asses.
 
Top Bottom