HC Game - Indy State

[Birdswin]

Well, get this going so Mel has a place to post the spread.

The Birds will need to pass more to get the offense moving and give the defense a rest from time-to-time. Indy State's defense is better than WIU.

I would love to see several quick scores - and then settle in. Be up 21-7 at half and finish with 38-17 win.

But would not be surprised to see a similar game as SIU and WIU.

 

[cpacmel]

Illinois State -10

Over / under 35.5

 

[Adunk33]

Illinois State -10

Over / under 35.5

Birds and over

 

[chuckie1980]

BIRDS 42
Trees 13

 

[redbirdfan04]

I am very worried about our passing game because we are going to need to score against this team to win. I hope our players do not over look this team. I was hoping they would open up the offense more the last two games.

Indy State 24
Redbirds 17

 

[Total Red]

Last big crowd of the year - Homecoming! Enjoy it.

We win by protecting the football and by not giving up X (big) plays.

No one treats Madbird like that and gets away with it. Vengeance is Ours.

 

[fourthandshort]

Hate to play to optics, but after the no show we pulled for Family Day game against NDSU, I think we need to break out the pass game like we did against NAU. Our pass game could use the reps and practice .. only threw 17 times against WIU and ran 45 times .. we needed 5 TOs to win that game.

Let's open things up some .. this roster has more potential and upside that we've shown so far this year. We get UNI and SDSU next ... both very tough defenses who we will likely struggle to run on .... we need to mix things up more. Let's make ISUb game our offensive tune-up ... like we attacked NAU.

James Robinson said it himself in press conference after the NAU game ... "pass game helps open up the run game". Got to make defenses pay for stacking the box ... and you don't do that by putting 2 TEs and FB in game .. that just makes things even more crowded. You do it with 3 WRs and TE ... and then throw them the ball.

If we mix it up nicely on offense, I can see us winning a 34-21 like game. If we stay conservative, it will be probably be a close game .. 7 or less points.

 

[Total Red]

When the more talented team loses turnovers are usually a major factor. Wisconsin plays great defense and they have a power between the tackles run game. They came in undefeated and managed to lose to some lightweight team the name of which escapes me. Wisconsin lost the turnover battle by giving it up 3 times and just getting one. Two of those three turnovers were fumbles but two of the turnovers came on pass attempts. One Int and one strip of the QB attempting to pass.

Paul Chryst HC Wisconsin is a sharp guy and a former Illinois State OC. Allow him to replay that game and he's not letting his QB throw a pick on the Badger's final possession with a two point lead. Coaches have a saying - "Listen to the fans and you'll soon be sitting amongst them".

 

[fourthandshort]

When the more talented team loses turnovers are usually a major factor. Wisconsin plays great defense and they have a power between the tackles run game. They came in undefeated and managed to lose to some lightweight team the name of which escapes me. Wisconsin lost the turnover battle by giving it up 3 times and just getting one. Two of those three turnovers were fumbles but two of the turnovers came on pass attempts. One Int and one strip of the QB attempting to pass.

Paul Chryst HC Wisconsin is a sharp guy and a former Illinois State OC. Allow him to replay that game and he's not letting his QB throw a pick on the Badger's final possession with a two point lead. Coaches have a saying - "Listen to the fans and you'll soon be sitting amongst them".

Hey TR ... completely agree on last possession, but my comments are a reaction to how often we go conservative in 1st half of so many games. My concern is this ... are we developing and preparing our offense (i.e. our pass game) adequately for UNI, SDSU, and NDSU ? I think we are missing our opportunities to get our unproven offense ready for the games we have recently struggled to win and get over the 6-5 hump. If we're worried about throwing a pick with 7 to14 point leads against WIU, EIU, SIU, Morehead St ... then maybe we don't belong in MVFC. Those are the games we should be fine tuning our pass game for when we play the truly tough defenses. I have become increasingly convinced, that is our main problem since 2015.

We're afraid to throw the ball with game on line against weaker teams. How are we ever going to learn to do it against tougher teams ?

 

[Birdswin]

If the reason we are not passing, is because we are screamed or worried about an interception - then we have BIG problems.

I guess, I thought it was because they wanted the clock to run and - if I have heard it once, I have heard it waaaay to much - a punt is not a bad play when you have the lead. Which makes me cringe a little.

I grew up watching and listening to Don Coryell as HC of the St. Louis Cardinals - he had a little known OC by the name of Joe Gibbs and a QB coach Rod Dowhower - talking about the best defense is an offense that scores and scores a lot. Keeping pressure on the defense - get the lead and attack, attack, attack!!!!

 

[Birdswin]

I hear Todd Berry is going to be at the game as an Honorary Captain. How about that. I wonder how many plays he could draw up?

 

[RedbirdSoxFan]

If the reason we are not passing, is because we are screamed or worried about an interception - then we have BIG problems.

I guess, I thought it was because they wanted the clock to run and - if I have heard it once, I have heard it waaaay to much - a punt is not a bad play when you have the lead. Which makes me cringe a little.

I grew up watching and listening to Don Coryell as HC of the St. Louis Cardinals - he had a little known OC by the name of Joe Gibbs and a QB coach Rod Dowhower - talking about the best defense is an offense that scores and scores a lot. Keeping pressure on the defense - get the lead and attack, attack, attack!!!!

Was just talking about Don Coryell the other day. How many Super Bowls could the Chargers have won if Buddy Ryan was the Chargers Defensive Coordinator?

 

[Total Red]

We're afraid to throw the ball with game on line against weaker teams. How are we ever going to learn to do it against tougher teams ?

Few thoughts on that:

1) You call it being afraid. I say taking care of the ball is sound judgement.
2) Practice is when you get focus on getting better. Games are when you focus on winning. If we need to throw more we will.
3) We throw the ball every game and I agree we need to do that. You've stated that we don't do it enough. I think we do it about right. It depends on the game/opponent and situation. If we get the lead against Indiana St. we're not going to throw a lot. I'm good with that.
4) Last and most important. You play to your strengths. Our top two receivers are injured. When we played NAU both Edgar and Grimes were healthy. They combined for 16 receptions and 286 yards against NAU. If we had them we would be throwing more. Our leading receiver is now a 5'8 true freshman. James Robinson are Jeff Proctor are outstanding backs. Again, you play to your strengths.

 

[Total Red]

I grew up watching and listening to Don Coryell as HC of the St. Louis Cardinals - he had a little known OC by the name of Joe Gibbs and a QB coach Rod Dowhower - talking about the best defense is an offense that scores and scores a lot. Keeping pressure on the defense - get the lead and attack, attack, attack!!!!

That made sense for them. Look at the personnel. They had a better offense and a lesser defense.

 

[fourthandshort]

I grew up watching and listening to Don Coryell as HC of the St. Louis Cardinals - he had a little known OC by the name of Joe Gibbs and a QB coach Rod Dowhower - talking about the best defense is an offense that scores and scores a lot. Keeping pressure on the defense - get the lead and attack, attack, attack!!!!

That made sense for them. Look at the personnel. They had a better offense and a lesser defense.

agree with yor point here TR .. personnel and playing to your strengths makes sense. But I'm not saying we need to lead with our pass game. I'm saying we need to lead with our run game, but also need to develop our pass game to take pressure off run game and keep really strong defenses more honest. It would be one thing if we played in a weaker conference and could get away with just dominating teams with our run game and strong defense. But if there is one thing I have learned in the MVFC it is this you need balance, both in terms of offense and defense, and running and passing, even while leading with run game. I really believe we should be fine tuning our pass game against weaker teams, instead of playing to "not lose" ... my characterization of what these games feel like .. and at same time, developing our young depleted WR group. So that when we play NDSU, SDSU, and UNI ... we are better prepared and able to mix things up more to keep their strong defenses more honest.

This year, we will probably get away with it because it will be the weakest SOS we've seen in long time ... certainly the weakest SOS in Spack era. We could go 8-4, seal an at large bid and not beat a single playoff team. EIU has really slipped, NAU was not as strong as people guessed with their stud QB healthy, and NIU even fell way off this year. And the bottom 3 or 4 in MVFC are the weakest they've been in 10 years.

So while 8-4 looks impressive in MVFC, it is just pretty good given our weak SOS compared to prior years. And I just don't think this prepares us well for playoffs. And I do believe this roster is loaded, especially when we get WR Edgar back (hopefully) and Davis hanging tough in pocket and throwing with confidence like he has shown glimpses of since he tore it up against NAU. He came out strong against WIU, but we went all conservative early because we couldn't shake them .. I would argue, our pass game approach is precisely why we couldn't shake them. They played to win, we played to "not lose" .. if not for 3 unforced TOs by WIU, we possibly lose that game. IMO this offensive approach makes much more sense in Q4, than in Q1 to Q3.

 

[ISUBU]

I hear Todd Berry is going to be at the game as an Honorary Captain. How about that. I wonder how many plays he could draw up?

Two divergent discussions merge.

Berry's first two Redbird teams weren't very good, although you could see improvement happening during the second year as young players started to grow into their roles. But the play calling was fun. Trick plays, wrinkles, just little things that were a bit risky - all of these made Redbird football exciting, even if they weren't winning. But by his third season, Kevin Glenn was now the full time starter, and the team was competitive. They'd make the playoffs for the first time that year, and then again in 1999, when they were probably the 2nd best team in the country. As the team got better, I thought it became more conservative. Fewer flashy plays, but more winning football.

 

[StLRedbird]

I think we know Spack's MO by now. We're going to see another conservative game plan Saturday. My sense of it is this. When Spack thinks he has better talent, he's gonna play it straight up. No gimmicks, smash mouth football. He's gonna run right at you with his huge OL and All-American RB and dare you to stop him. We used to love this about him, but a few 6-5 seasons have, uhh, taken the bloom off that rose.

Stumps 6
'birds 24

 

[StLRedbird]

I hear Todd Berry is going to be at the game as an Honorary Captain. How about that. I wonder how many plays he could draw up?

Two divergent discussions merge.

Berry's first two Redbird teams weren't very good, although you could see improvement happening during the second year as young players started to grow into their roles. But the play calling was fun. Trick plays, wrinkles, just little things that were a bit risky - all of these made Redbird football exciting, even if they weren't winning. But by his third season, Kevin Glenn was now the full time starter, and the team was competitive. They'd make the playoffs for the first time that year, and then again in 1999, when they were probably the 2nd best team in the country. As the team got better, I thought it became more conservative. Fewer flashy plays, but more winning football.

I think Kevin Glenn is easily the best QB we've had here. Reasonable people could disagree about #2. :lol:

 

[redbirdfan04]

I hear Todd Berry is going to be at the game as an Honorary Captain. How about that. I wonder how many plays he could draw up?

Two divergent discussions merge.

Berry's first two Redbird teams weren't very good, although you could see improvement happening during the second year as young players started to grow into their roles. But the play calling was fun. Trick plays, wrinkles, just little things that were a bit risky - all of these made Redbird football exciting, even if they weren't winning. But by his third season, Kevin Glenn was now the full time starter, and the team was competitive. They'd make the playoffs for the first time that year, and then again in 1999, when they were probably the 2nd best team in the country. As the team got better, I thought it became more conservative. Fewer flashy plays, but more winning football.

I think Kevin Glenn is easily the best QB we've had here. Reasonable people could disagree about #2. :lol:

Kevin Glenn has had the most success post ISU but if I got to make the best of roster for an all time ISU team I am going with Matt Brown at QB.

 

[StLRedbird]

Both of them could flat out make plays. Brown's my #2. Glenn won the biggest games in ISU history at the time. Ran into a stone wall named Adrian Peterson.