Non-conference thoughts

[BackTheBirds]

So far:
UCF
Belmont
UIC
@UAB
@TCU
Cincy
WKU/BGSU
Valpo/Fordham/GCU/Nevada

Pretty solid start to the non-conference. Any thoughts of who the Birds should fill the rest of the schedule with?

 

[Redbird222]

History would tell us there will be a D2 game at home.

3 - 4 more after that.

I would like
SLU or Dayton
At Marquette
East Tennesse St
Weak team strategically placed

 

[CaliRdBrd]

How about a team that makes me want to watch.

 

[IHateWSU]

Last year they rolled out the Non Conf schedule on Twitter at the end of July, I wonder when they plan to release it this year.

 

[Adunk33]

Ironically, enough. It was exactly a year ago today where they put out the emojis.

As the schedule stands right now, I think it is a very good start. It still leaves something desired. Agreed that it would be nice to see the start of another MM H&H (SLU, Murray State, Belmont, VCU types). I wouldn't mind another buy game. As most know, I've never been a fan of "playing for an at-large" mindset because the NCAA will do anything and everything to give MM the short end of the stick. However, I do believe there is value in playing the most challenging non-con possible. It's kind of the same idea of when I trained for my first 5K run back in the day. I trained as if I was doing a 10K, so when it got to race day I would think, "Hey, that wasn't so tough." Then again, you want winnable games peppered in there for the sake of your team's confidence. Losing can take a toll on players and really make them drop their heads.

I'd be all for adding another P5 buy game, a very winnable home game (Chicago State or something), and a high level MM as said before.

Ultimately, the non-con record doesn't matter as long as we grow as a team and gain experience. We play for the 3-4 days in March.

 

[ChiRedbirdfan]

Ironically, enough. It was exactly a year ago today where they put out the emojis.

As the schedule stands right now, I think it is a very good start. It still leaves something desired. Agreed that it would be nice to see the start of another MM H&H (SLU, Murray State, Belmont, VCU types). I wouldn't mind another buy game. As most know, I've never been a fan of "playing for an at-large" mindset because the NCAA will do anything and everything to give MM the short end of the stick. However, I do believe there is value in playing the most challenging non-con possible. It's kind of the same idea of when I trained for my first 5K run back in the day. I trained as if I was doing a 10K, so when it got to race day I would think, "Hey, that wasn't so tough." Then again, you want winnable games peppered in there for the sake of your team's confidence. Losing can take a toll on players and really make them drop their heads.

I'd be all for adding another P5 buy game, a very winnable home game (Chicago State or something), and a high level MM as said before.

Ultimately, the non-con record doesn't matter as long as we grow as a team and gain experience. We play for the 3-4 days in March.

Schedule is too much on the soft side to be intentionally adding a Chicago State, IMO, esp without knowing the overall strength of the MVC. Plus playing those types of teams are another reason not to buy season tickets for the area fringe fans or anyone in the Chicagoland area that has to drive to attend home games.

 

[Redbirdwarrior]

Rememeber back when we'd see the OOC and the BIGGEST name on there would be UIC? I do. It is nice that Dan wants to challenge his guys with winnable but still highly challenging games every year.

I believe that the Valley is probably a 1-2 bid league for the foreseeable future, so the KEY is what happened after Christmas. If we lose all of these games, but end up winning 4 more Valley games than we would have because of things we have learned in OOC, then it is 100% worth it.

The key is getting the hell out of Thursday and playing well in St. Louis. Our season is effectively 1 weekend long. The rest is exhibition.

 

[ChiRedbirdfan]

The key is getting the hell out of Thursday and playing well in St. Louis. Our season is effectively 1 weekend long. The rest is exhibition.

We all know there is two ways to Get an entry to the NCAA tourney:

1. Compete nationally be one of the top 50 that would earn an invite to the tourney

2. Win the MVC tourney


When fans and the ISU basketball program give up on competing nationally for option #1 then that is the official acknowledgement that the MVC, and more importantly ISU basketball, is no longer relevant on a national basis. I’ll admit that we unfortunately are close to that point and heading in that direction but I believe it is too early to throw in the towel. I hope ISU athletics can dig deep and come up with a new strategy that will allow ISU men’s basketball to become more competitive again on a national basis. The ISU basketball history is too rich to just let it completely fade away.

 

[Redbirdwarrior]

It isn't that I'm giving up on ISU being a nationally relevant T50 team, it is that the NCAA has proven that it really isn't T50. It is T50 if you are from a power 6. If you are from the Valley, you need to be T25 (Hell, St. Mary's might argue T20).

It isn't that ISU can't be or won't be a T50 team. It is that even if they were a 24+ win team going into St. Louis, the NCAA has PROVEN than they look at conference affiliation first and actual team success second if at all.

 

[Adunk33]

It isn't that I'm giving up on ISU being a nationally relevant T50 team, it is that the NCAA has proven that it really isn't T50. It is T50 if you are from a power 6. If you are from the Valley, you need to be T25 (Hell, St. Mary's might argue T20).

It isn't that ISU can't be or won't be a T50 team. It is that even if they were a 24+ win team going into St. Louis, the NCAA has PROVEN than they look at conference affiliation first and actual team success second if at all.

:text-+1:

Not giving up on the idea of competing nationally at all. I've just seen the hypocrisy of the NCAA too many time to have faith that they will do the right/honerable thing when it comes tournament selection time. MM's started to figure out how to make RPI work for them, and the NCAA decided to change their criteria. Do you think that was just a coincidence? This quadrant system clearly has a positive skew towards the P5. A team could go 7-13 in their conference but since they played 14 games against Q1 and may have gone 1-13 they are rewarded for playing the Q1 games, even if their other 6 wins were against the Q3 teams in the conference. Where you take an MVC school who might only get 1 chance to play a Q1 in a buy game and they lose, then maybe picks up a win against a Q2 in the noncon and does really well against Q3/4 it doesn't matter.

As another poster mentioned, we are not that far removed from the biggest games on our schedule being against Norfolk State and Winston-Salem State. So I love seeing the schedules Muller has put together. We need to win some of these noncon games- no doubt about it. However, why leave it up to chance? Take care of business and win on Sunday in March. That is the only way 100% a MM team will get in.

 

[Redbird60451]

It isn't that I'm giving up on ISU being a nationally relevant T50 team, it is that the NCAA has proven that it really isn't T50. It is T50 if you are from a power 6. If you are from the Valley, you need to be T25 (Hell, St. Mary's might argue T20).

It isn't that ISU can't be or won't be a T50 team. It is that even if they were a 24+ win team going into St. Louis, the NCAA has PROVEN than they look at conference affiliation first and actual team success second if at all.

I totally agree. I think a team like ISU need win in St. Louis no matter what, you could almost be undefeated and if you drop the final badly (and we've done that a few times, Drake & WSU), the NCAA will say NO.

Based on roster turn over and pre-season predictions, I also see there's no way ISU gets into the T25. We all like to say 'what do they know'. Well they know enough to put us down in such a hole in the valley that it will be extremely difficult to even get a vote in a poll. Also all the coaches are reading that stuff too and for a last min game do I want to play the team predicted to finish 1st in the MVC or 8th in the MVC, who's going to help/hurt me more?

ISU will pretty much have to go undefeated in the Non-Con to start getting votes in the polls, and based on the teams in the tournament we are in we will have good wins, but no huge take notice wins. And that non-con tourney is the only spot ISU will get one of those, till they make noise in the tourney. Right now the big dogs view ISU like ISU views Western IL or South Eastern Missouri State.

 

[redbirds2000]

The key is getting the hell out of Thursday and playing well in St. Louis. Our season is effectively 1 weekend long. The rest is exhibition.

We all know there is two ways to Get an entry to the NCAA tourney:

1. Compete nationally be one of the top 50 that would earn an invite to the tourney

2. Win the MVC tourney


When fans and the ISU basketball program give up on competing nationally for option #1 then that is the official acknowledgement that the MVC, and more importantly ISU basketball, is no longer relevant on a national basis. I’ll admit that we unfortunately are close to that point and heading in that direction but I believe it is too early to throw in the towel. I hope ISU athletics can dig deep and come up with a new strategy that will allow ISU men’s basketball to become more competitive again on a national basis. The ISU basketball history is too rich to just let it completely fade away.

Rich history? If you were to rank the basketball histories of the current MVC programs, where does ISU's history rank?

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

 

[ChiRedbirdfan]

Rich history?....I was on campus during the early to middle 80's and ISU hoops was competitive on a national basis and the program was respected. That is the history I am referencing. Unfortunately the last 20 years have been borderline awful and ISU hoops image and relevancy has diminished esp on a national basis.

to answer you question there is no doubt that ISU hoops brings up the rear of the MVC when ranking the program based upon the results that matter most, IMO, which is post season appearances/performance

 

[Phantom]

We had some sizable clout in the 80s & most of the 90s. Then nothing for awhile. Then for the last 10-11 years we've been consistently good actually (only one sub .500 season in that stretch), with some real good teams, but unfortunately nothing to show for it except for a string of NIT appearances and heartbreaking conference title game efforts.

Until we start consistently winning games on the big stage and of course, making the Dance, we're going to be mired in that just-good-enough-not-to-suck purgatory.

 

[Redbird222]

We had some sizable clout in the 80s & most of the 90s. Then nothing for awhile. Then for the last 10-11 years we've been consistently good actually (only one sub .500 season in that stretch), with some real good teams, but unfortunately nothing to show for it except for a string of NIT appearances and heartbreaking conference title game efforts.

Until we start consistently winning games on the big stage and of course, making the Dance, we're going to be mired in that just-good-enough-not-to-suck purgatory.

Purgatory is a scheduling nightmare ... lose to us and it is generally considered a poor loss. We are most likely not an attendance booster for the other team and a win may have minimal positive impact in regards to the standards used by the committee. We have beaten low to mid tier P5 schools so I would think they would consider us a risky team (capared to the benefirs) to schedule.

Given all of these barriers I understand why P5 shy away and I actually give Dan kudos on the scheduling. I have only complaint ... why do we not open with a winnable first game vs often hitting the road with a competitive opponent?

 

[DaveBird10]

We had some sizable clout in the 80s & most of the 90s. Then nothing for awhile. Then for the last 10-11 years we've been consistently good actually (only one sub .500 season in that stretch), with some real good teams, but unfortunately nothing to show for it except for a string of NIT appearances and heartbreaking conference title game efforts.

Until we start consistently winning games on the big stage and of course, making the Dance, we're going to be mired in that just-good-enough-not-to-suck purgatory.

Purgatory is a scheduling nightmare ... lose to us and it is generally considered a poor loss. We are most likely not an attendance booster for the other team and a win may have minimal positive impact in regards to the standards used by the committee. We have beaten low to mid tier P5 schools so I would think they would consider us a risky team (capared to the benefirs) to schedule.

Given all of these barriers I understand why P5 shy away and I actually give Dan kudos on the scheduling. I have only complaint ... why do we not open with a winnable first game vs often hitting the road with a competitive opponent?

I believe we open on the road the opening weekend is because redbird arena is being used for ihsa volleyball state finals that weekend.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

[Anonymous]

We had some sizable clout in the 80s & most of the 90s. Then nothing for awhile. Then for the last 10-11 years we've been consistently good actually (only one sub .500 season in that stretch), with some real good teams, but unfortunately nothing to show for it except for a string of NIT appearances and heartbreaking conference title game efforts.

Until we start consistently winning games on the big stage and of course, making the Dance, we're going to be mired in that just-good-enough-not-to-suck purgatory.

Purgatory is a scheduling nightmare ... lose to us and it is generally considered a poor loss. We are most likely not an attendance booster for the other team and a win may have minimal positive impact in regards to the standards used by the committee. We have beaten low to mid tier P5 schools so I would think they would consider us a risky team (capared to the benefirs) to schedule.

Given all of these barriers I understand why P5 shy away and I actually give Dan kudos on the scheduling. I have only complaint ... why do we not open with a winnable first game vs often hitting the road with a competitive opponent?

I believe we open on the road the opening weekend is because redbird arena is being used for ihsa volleyball state finals that weekend.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

We are actually at home the IHSA volleyball weekend. IHSA volleyball is Fri-Sat Nov. 15-16 and we're home vs. UCF on Sun Nov. 17.

 

[Redbird222]

Purgatory is a scheduling nightmare ... lose to us and it is generally considered a poor loss. We are most likely not an attendance booster for the other team and a win may have minimal positive impact in regards to the standards used by the committee. We have beaten low to mid tier P5 schools so I would think they would consider us a risky team (capared to the benefirs) to schedule.

Given all of these barriers I understand why P5 shy away and I actually give Dan kudos on the scheduling. I have only complaint ... why do we not open with a winnable first game vs often hitting the road with a competitive opponent?

I believe we open on the road the opening weekend is because redbird arena is being used for ihsa volleyball state finals that weekend.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

We are actually at home the IHSA volleyball weekend. IHSA volleyball is Fri-Sat Nov. 15-16 and we're home vs. UCF on Sun Nov. 17.

Yep and the NCAA moved the opening day to earlier in the week. Opening day is Tuesday Nov 5th this year. Last year we did open at home and beat FGSU and loss to Belmont on the road the next game.

 

[Buffett]

Bradley's non con

Millikin (exhibition)
at St. Joseph's
IUPUI-. UIC
Norfolk State
Radford-
Ft. Myers Tip-Off- Northwestern
Ft. Myers Tip-Off- either Kansas State or Pitt
North Carolina A&T
Maryville (Div. II)
Georgia Southern-
at Miami
Toledo

 

[ISU86]

Bradley's non con

Millikin (exhibition)
at St. Joseph's
IUPUI-. UIC
Norfolk State
Radford-
Ft. Myers Tip-Off- Northwestern
Ft. Myers Tip-Off- either Kansas State or Pitt
North Carolina A&T
Maryville (Div. II)
Georgia Southern-
at Miami
Toledo

missing at Memphis

Millikin [exhibition]
at Saint Joseph's
IUPUI
Illinois-Chicago
Norfolk State
Radford
vs Northwestern
vs Kansas State or Pittsburgh
at Memphis
North Carolina A&T
Maryville [D-II]
Georgia Southern
at Miami (Ohio)
Toledo