Northwestern University

[cubird]

Should be players available. Maybe preferred walk ons or guys deeper on the depth chart want to stay close to home. Timing sucks this late in the summer.

 

[Redbirdwarrior]

This is terrible for not only NW football, but the entire university, the Big 10 and the city of Chicago. After Northwestern's recent bumps up from the cellar of the Big 10, they have been getting far more press and donations. The upgrade to Ryan Field, which has now been put in serious doubt after several NW board members expressed reluctance to invest in the program citing this hazing stuff, was going to make Chicago a destination to watch college football. Now, Ryan Field, while still a cool place to watch a game, will not be a destination game for anyone who wants to see their home school.

I do hope other programs of all sports are paying attention to how hazing is regarded in 2023. Every single sport at every single school has some kind of brotherhood ritual. If it can get Pat Fitzgerald fired from NW (Which is the equivalent of if Doug Collins was coaching ISU basketball), there is no coach, administrator or university leader who is safe from this.
As for NW, expect them to sit in the bottom of the Big 10 for at least 4 or 5 years as their stadium crumbles around them and the stink of this scandal goes away.

 

[Virginia Redbird]

The last two seasons for Fitzgerald have been pretty bleak. He has had some highs and lows at NU. His status as player and coach at the University probably helped him through the poor seasons. I have read some reports on the hazing allegations. I don't know how accurate any of them are but they are clearly not appropriate in this current day and age. I am completely against hazing traditions in any event. My guess is Fitzgerald knew everything. He grew up in Wildcat culture so how could he not know? Still even if he did not know, he is the Head Coach and the buck stops at his desk. He is responsible. I don't believe the immediate future looks bright for the purple and white. Lawsuits are waiting in the wings, more bad press coming, and funding probably drying up a bit. They will need to find the right coach to clean up the mess.

 

[MadBird]

The last two seasons for Fitzgerald have been pretty bleak. He has had some highs and lows at NU. His status as player and coach at the University probably helped him through the poor seasons. I have read some reports on the hazing allegations. I don't know how accurate any of them are but they are clearly not appropriate in this current day and age. I am completely against hazing traditions in any event. My guess is Fitzgerald knew everything. He grew up in Wildcat culture so how could he not know? Still even if he did not know, he is the Head Coach and the buck stops at his desk. He is responsible. I don't believe the immediate future looks bright for the purple and white. Lawsuits are waiting in the wings, more bad press coming, and funding probably drying up a bit. They will need to find the right coach to clean up the mess.

Yeah, and it's not gonna be easy to get someone on board. And is it a different NU alum to take this on, or someone with no connection to the program, and surely no connection to Coach Fitz? Coach Fitz prolly wishes he'd taken up one of those NFL offers now. And will any more come his way now?

In this day of the portal, seems unlikely crazy hazing will continue. I know if some 300 lb. oaf tried to dry hump me, I'd be out the door tomorrow.

 

[glenn_ma]

Yeah, and it's not gonna be easy to get someone on board. And is it a different NU alum to take this on, or someone with no connection to the program, and surely no connection to Coach Fitz? Coach Fitz prolly wishes he'd taken up one of those NFL offers now. And will any more come his way now?

In this day of the portal, seems unlikely crazy hazing will continue. I know if some 300 lb. oaf tried to dry hump me, I'd be out the door tomorrow.

I think that was the point, they only hazed the underperforming freshman.

 

[RBFANTOO]

Should be players available. Maybe preferred walk ons or guys deeper on the depth chart want to stay close to home. Timing sucks this late in the summer.

I agree, there must be some players leaving NW. Are we trying to get any to strengthen our lineup?

 

[Total Red]

Football has a dark side with a culture of abuse. It's a game of controlled aggression and that aggression is supposed to take place on the field and from snap to whistle. Since football players get hit with penalties during games with everyone watching (late hits, unnecessary roughness etc.), it should not come as much of a surprise that even more egregious behavior can take place behind closed doors. The culture starts at the top. It used to be that coaches could physically abuse players (grabbing face masks, shoving, poking) but you don't get that much these days. Verbal abuse is still prevalent. Head coaches tear into asst. coaches and players. Asst. coaches rip players, and star/veteran players abuse younger less talented players. Sometimes the abuse goes beyond verbal. When hazing and harassment take on a sexualized nature as it has with Northwestern you know that it has been going on for quite a while. You don't from verbal to "Naked QB/Center exchanges," "Dry Humping" and "Car Wash" overnight.
Some apologists will say that the abuse is necessary to instill the proper level of motivation, effort and discipline. I'd like to see the hard evidence that shows that hazing leads to winning. I'm sure some winning teams do it, but it definitely wasn't working for Northwestern. The 'Cats were 1-11 last season. Maybe it's a good way to disassociate yourself from the losing by blaming and humiliating other players.
And I'm not buying Coach Fitz with his excuse that he didn't know about it. He was on the throne of Northwestern Football, and he set the tone. Did he tell his staff and players that he had an open door, and did he let them know that he was ready, willing and able to address problems and concerns that they might have? Did he let them know that that applied to everyone, including freshmen and walk-ons? Obviously, the HC can't be bothered with petty concerns, but sexually abusive hazing is not a petty concern. Did the victims not feel safe talking to him? Did they fear he would not do anything about it and then they would get it even worse? Not a single player or team captain came forward to let him know? None of the asst. coaches or athletic staff ever saw or heard anything worth sharing? If so, Coach Fitz should be fired for a culture of non-communication.
People knew, but somewhere along the line they got the idea that this was accepted and there was no need to make waves by reporting it. It's only a slight improvement over what happened at Penn St. when HC Joe Paterno was reportedly informed of the sexual abuse activity of his DC Jerry Sandusky many years before Sandusky was sent to jail in 2012 for "involuntary deviate sexual intercourse," which is a fancy way of saying he sodomized a 10-year-old boy in the locker room showers.

We've made some progress since then, but not much.

A comprehensive look at Northwestern football’s hazing allegations

All you need to know about the rapidly evolving situation.

www.insidenu.com

 

[CaliRdBrd]

Football has a dark side with a culture of abuse. It's a game of controlled aggression and that aggression is supposed to take place on the field and from snap to whistle. Since football players get hit with penalties during games with everyone watching (late hits, unnecessary roughness etc.), it should not come as much of a surprise that even more egregious behavior can take place behind closed doors. The culture starts at the top. It used to be that coaches could physically abuse players (grabbing face masks, shoving, poking) but you don't get that much these days. Verbal abuse is still prevalent. Head coaches tear into asst. coaches and players. Asst. coaches rip players, and star/veteran players abuse younger less talented players. Sometimes the abuse goes beyond verbal. When hazing and harassment take on a sexualized nature as it has with Northwestern you know that it has been going on for quite a while. You don't from verbal to "Naked QB/Center exchanges," "Dry Humping" and "Car Wash" overnight.
Some apologists will say that the abuse is necessary to instill the proper level of motivation, effort and discipline. I'd like to see the hard evidence that shows that hazing leads to winning. I'm sure some winning teams do it, but it definitely wasn't working for Northwestern. The 'Cats were 1-11 last season. Maybe it's a good way to disassociate yourself from the losing by blaming and humiliating other players.
And I'm not buying Coach Fitz with his excuse that he didn't know about it. He was on the throne of Northwestern Football, and he set the tone. Did he tell his staff and players that he had an open door, and did he let them know that he was ready, willing and able to address problems and concerns that they might have? Did he let them know that that applied to everyone, including freshmen and walk-ons? Obviously, the HC can't be bothered with petty concerns, but sexually abusive hazing is not a petty concern. Did the victims not feel safe talking to him? Did they fear he would not do anything about it and then they would get it even worse? Not a single player or team captain came forward to let him know? None of the asst. coaches or athletic staff ever saw or heard anything worth sharing? If so, Coach Fitz should be fired for a culture of non-communication.
People knew, but somewhere along the line they got the idea that this was accepted and there was no need to make waves by reporting it. It's only a slight improvement over what happened at Penn St. when HC Joe Paterno was reportedly informed of the sexual abuse activity of his DC Jerry Sandusky many years before Sandusky was sent to jail in 2012 for "involuntary deviate sexual intercourse," which is a fancy way of saying he sodomized a 10-year-old boy in the locker room showers.

We've made some progress since then, but not much.

A comprehensive look at Northwestern football’s hazing allegations

All you need to know about the rapidly evolving situation.

www.insidenu.com

Or, maybe none of the allegations are true.

 

[fourthandshort]

The clapping account is certainly damning. I mean, who thinks to make something like this up, if it wasn't true. If more former players come out of the woodwork and verify this ... there are going to be a lot of lawsuits.

I find this all hard to believe about Fitz, but much stranger things have happened. You just like to believe in people sometimes .. and are still wrong some of those times.

 

[Total Red]

Or, maybe none of the allegations are true.

I don't know if you read the entire article I attached but several players, past and present, have supported the allegations along with some staff members. I suppose they could all be lying but the NU President reluctantly came to the conclusion that hazing took place after getting the results of an independent investigation. If he believes hazing took place then I do too. I am also aware that many former players are saying that they never witnessed the type of hazing described in the article. That's possible. And I think Coach Fitz deliberately distanced himself from the acts of hazing. By not going into the locker room when they occurred he gave himself deniability. A Head Coach doesn't want to get his hands dirty with that type of thing. Bobby Knight once got in trouble when practice film showed him putting his hand around a player's throat. Coaches are smarter now. They can leave it to the players to hand out punishments. Some team leaders may go easy on their fellow players. Others could be more vicious and twisted. Since team captains/leadership changes quickly you could go through short eras where punishments are mild and then they could turn more extreme. So maybe some former players did not experience these types of hazing while others did. Bottom line - if the Head Coach gives team leaders the license to mete out punishment then he has to take responsibility when it goes too far, whether he was there or not.

 

[Total Red]

I agree, there must be some players leaving NW. Are we trying to get any to strengthen our lineup?

Today is the first day that a Northwestern FB player has entered the transfer portal since the scandal broke. He's a former 4 star safety so he might be beyond our reach but there will be more. The portal is technically closed at this time but a coaching change is one of the loopholes you can use to gain entry.

 

[CaliRdBrd]

I don't know if you read the entire article I attached but several players, past and present, have supported the allegations along with some staff members. I suppose they could all be lying but the NU President reluctantly came to the conclusion that hazing took place after getting the results of an independent investigation. If he believes hazing took place then I do too. I am also aware that many former players are saying that they never witnessed the type of hazing described in the article. That's possible. And I think Coach Fitz deliberately distanced himself from the acts of hazing. By not going into the locker room when they occurred he gave himself deniability. A Head Coach doesn't want to get his hands dirty with that type of thing. Bobby Knight once got in trouble when practice film showed him putting his hand around a player's throat. Coaches are smarter now. They can leave it to the players to hand out punishments. Some team leaders may go easy on their fellow players. Others could be more vicious and twisted. Since team captains/leadership changes quickly you could go through short eras where punishments are mild and then they could turn more extreme. So maybe some former players did not experience these types of hazing while others did. Bottom line - if the Head Coach gives team leaders the license to mete out punishment then he has to take responsibility when it goes too far, whether he was there or not.

It’s just so hard to believe. I have friends that played D1, one at UCLA. I recently asked him about this and he also had a very difficult time believing this happened.
Testimony is a bit damning though.

 

[CaliRdBrd]

So now a majority of NW players have asked Ben Crump to file a lawsuit against the university?
Nothing reeks of shakedown more than Crump’s involvement.
I’ll now firmly stand behind my original position of “witch hunt”.

 

[Manchester Matt]

Patrick Salvi is one of the attorneys In the second lawsuit. One of my good friends is a lawyer with knowledge of him and said, “He wouldn’t put his name on this lawsuit if there weren’t merit to the allegations.”

 

[Total Red]

If I rec'd the type of hazing described I would want compensation. The more I think about this the uglier it gets. What do young people do when they think something is funny, unusual or interesting? They whip their phone out and start recording, that's what they do. So there you are doing the naked bear crawl. If you're lucky your teammates only send it to your girlfriend for laughs. It could get worse. It could get uploaded to a gay porn site where it resides for perpetuity. Maybe someone sends the link to your parents or grandparents, and it is still discoverable when you have children. Nice way to be remembered right?

This is sick, sick stuff and it has to stop. CaliRdBrd - it is a safe bet that neither of us will make it on the jury for this lawsuit. We're already leaning hard to opposite sides.

 

[fourthandshort]

So now a majority of NW players have asked Ben Crump to file a lawsuit against the university?
Nothing reeks of shakedown more than Crump’s involvement.
I’ll now firmly stand behind my original position of “witch hunt”.

this is all it takes for you to pick sides and draw firm conclusions ?

 

[CaliRdBrd]

this is all it takes for you to pick sides and draw firm conclusions ?

It’s not a stretch.

 

[Virginia Redbird]

Football has a dark side with a culture of abuse. It's a game of controlled aggression and that aggression is supposed to take place on the field and from snap to whistle. Since football players get hit with penalties during games with everyone watching (late hits, unnecessary roughness etc.), it should not come as much of a surprise that even more egregious behavior can take place behind closed doors. The culture starts at the top. It used to be that coaches could physically abuse players (grabbing face masks, shoving, poking) but you don't get that much these days. Verbal abuse is still prevalent. Head coaches tear into asst. coaches and players. Asst. coaches rip players, and star/veteran players abuse younger less talented players. Sometimes the abuse goes beyond verbal. When hazing and harassment take on a sexualized nature as it has with Northwestern you know that it has been going on for quite a while. You don't from verbal to "Naked QB/Center exchanges," "Dry Humping" and "Car Wash" overnight.
Some apologists will say that the abuse is necessary to instill the proper level of motivation, effort and discipline. I'd like to see the hard evidence that shows that hazing leads to winning. I'm sure some winning teams do it, but it definitely wasn't working for Northwestern. The 'Cats were 1-11 last season. Maybe it's a good way to disassociate yourself from the losing by blaming and humiliating other players.
And I'm not buying Coach Fitz with his excuse that he didn't know about it. He was on the throne of Northwestern Football, and he set the tone. Did he tell his staff and players that he had an open door, and did he let them know that he was ready, willing and able to address problems and concerns that they might have? Did he let them know that that applied to everyone, including freshmen and walk-ons? Obviously, the HC can't be bothered with petty concerns, but sexually abusive hazing is not a petty concern. Did the victims not feel safe talking to him? Did they fear he would not do anything about it and then they would get it even worse? Not a single player or team captain came forward to let him know? None of the asst. coaches or athletic staff ever saw or heard anything worth sharing? If so, Coach Fitz should be fired for a culture of non-communication.
People knew, but somewhere along the line they got the idea that this was accepted and there was no need to make waves by reporting it. It's only a slight improvement over what happened at Penn St. when HC Joe Paterno was reportedly informed of the sexual abuse activity of his DC Jerry Sandusky many years before Sandusky was sent to jail in 2012 for "involuntary deviate sexual intercourse," which is a fancy way of saying he sodomized a 10-year-old boy in the locker room showers.

We've made some progress since then, but not much.

A comprehensive look at Northwestern football’s hazing allegations

All you need to know about the rapidly evolving situation.

www.insidenu.com

I cant comment on the allegations, I have read the info put out so far and I lean on the side of believing it but what is written in the press is very often not totally accurate. Hazing should not happen and has nothing to do with building winning programs. No player should be subjected to that type of treatment. I will date myself a bit but I well remember a book by a former Texas player called "Meat on the Hoof". The book detailed a large number of allegations against the Darrell Royal run program. Some former Longhorns said it was lies, some supported it, some said it was a marginal player with an axe to grind. Who knows. Some of it was likely true, especially in those days. But how much truth only the people involved really know. It used to be pretty brutal though. My High School coach had a carved wooden stick about 2 feet long and about an inch in diameter he carried around on the practice field. He used to smack you in the helmet with it when you made a mistake. Especially with what we know today about concussions that was stupid and dangerous. I got my share of smacks and your head just rang. We also had a line coach who was a former Redbird D lineman. Big guy for the time at about 6'3' 250 pounds or so. He took an underperforming offensive lineman who was about 180 pounds and stood over him and at the whistle he would just pound that High School lineman. After about 4 times doing this he caught the lineman with a vicious forearm to the forehead and knocked him out cold. Our D line coach was scared as hell for time until the lineman woke up, concussed. It was just that way in the late 60s/early 70s. Mostly those days are gone I hope but hazing is flat out wrong and if true I have no sympathy for NU or Fitzgerald at all. It is a very violent game of course but there are limits.

 

[fourthandshort]

It’s not a stretch.

All that independently gathered evidence by a firm NU hired .. that is, not an overly zealous prosecutor looking to make a name for his/her self. And you declare Northwestern/Fitzgerald innocent, because 8 former players hired Crump (and Levin) to represent them. I'm quite sure you have no idea of their innocence or otherwise .. nor do I. But youve picked a side already because of the atty who got hired - is 8 even a "majority" as you presumed ?

I just prefer to wait to see more evidence before I reach conclusions. But I can say it does not look good per the independently gathered evidence released to this point .. regardless of who hires which attys.

 

[TBS_20]

i just dont get why they want to walk around knowing someone watched them dry hump their homeboy.