Illinois State to the MAC?

[Chi-bird]

Joining the MAC and “moving up” 10-15 years ago would have been a good move. I’m not sure with what it is we’d be moving up to now….possibly moving up to stay in the same pecking order. I have always enjoyed the bowl games but as more and more players opt out from them, along with the expansion, I’m not sure what will be left, similarly, with the NIL, transfer portal, and the bigger conferences continuing to gobble up other conferences and schools, I think we’ll start seeing a further separation between the big players and the mid majors. I wouldn’t doubt that the group of five schools begin to look to more of a current FCS model as a solution to their economic woes and postseason malaise. It’s possible that moving up is eventually really going to become essentially staying in the de-facto new FCS.

 

[isuquinndog]

Agree Mark...but ISU enrollment has been flat a very long time. Lets hope the plan is for growth esp with addition of the new Engineering program. UIUC and UIC are the only two publics that have been growing. Both illinois publics have grown dramatically the last 20 years despite, the arguments made by some, that politicians would prohibit public ISU from measured growth because of failing EIU and WIU. State of Illinois is much better off with a strongly positioned ISU that competes for students across state lines with many institutions much stronger than EIU and WIU.

Hopefully enrollment is starting to grow. Enrollment in fall of 2022 was 20,683 and in 2023 it was 20,989 (undergrad).

Illinois State sees largest freshman class in 36 years, continued strong enrollment

Illinois State University welcomed 4,147 freshmen to its student body for the 2023-24 academic year, its largest incoming class in 36 years.

news.illinoisstate.edu

 

[fourthandshort]

ISU enrollment is flat? Yeah I'm not so sure.

Illinois State sees largest freshman class in 36 years, continued strong enrollment

Illinois State University welcomed 4,147 freshmen to its student body for the 2023-24 academic year, its largest incoming class in 36 years.

news.illinoisstate.edu

I think if you look at total enrollments for all 4 classes, it is relatively flat. Not as sure whether that is for undergrad or total. But Ive seen mostly flat total numbers. Here is one source showing 2012-21: Illinois State University | Data USA

2023 was up to 20,989 .. which is highest since at least 2012, but not by much. More to the point, we are doing much better than all IL public schools, other than U of I, and maybe UIC .. but that is commuter school. 2021 was a recent low point, but that would likely have been a pandemic related hit.

University	Illinois State University
Sum of Enrollment	Column Labels
Row Labels	Full time	Part time	Grand Total
2012	18,309	2,397	20,706
2013	17,864	2,408	20,272
2014	18,219	2,396	20,615
2015	18,290	2,470	20,760
2016	18,694	2,345	21,039
2017	18,368	2,416	20,784
2018	18,207	2,428	20,635
2019	18,467	2,411	20,878
2020	18,043	2,677	20,720
2021	17,733	2,500	20,233
Grand Total	182194​	24448​	206642​

 

[jwa123]

Damm ... either crazy is going to night school to learn grammar, or Quinnie finally added that grammar check app Ive been asking about for years.

Nice post Mark ... it was actually rather comprehensible.

I miss the old Mark .

 

[isuquinndog]

I think if you look at total enrollments for all 4 classes, it is relatively flat. Not as sure whether that is for undergrad or total. But Ive seen mostly flat total numbers. Here is one source showing 2012-21: Illinois State University | Data USA

2023 was up to 20,989 .. which is highest since at least 2012, but not by much. More to the point, we are doing much better than all IL public schools, other than U of I, and maybe UIC .. but that is commuter school. 2021 was a recent low point, but that would likely have been a pandemic related hit.

University	Illinois State University
Sum of Enrollment	Column Labels
Row Labels	Full time	Part time	Grand Total
2012	18,309	2,397	20,706
2013	17,864	2,408	20,272
2014	18,219	2,396	20,615
2015	18,290	2,470	20,760
2016	18,694	2,345	21,039
2017	18,368	2,416	20,784
2018	18,207	2,428	20,635
2019	18,467	2,411	20,878
2020	18,043	2,677	20,720
2021	17,733	2,500	20,233
Grand Total	182194​	24448​	206642​

ISU publishes this data.

Student Enrollment Reports | Planning, Research and Policy Analysis | Illinois State

prpa.illinoisstate.edu

 

[ISUBird]

I know at least a decade ago it was the plan to keep enrollment steady. With losing Central Campus and then Southside even with the addition of Cardinal Court housing space is way down. off campus housing has not made up for it.

I do believe that they plan to build another dorm and hopefully that would be the start of the increase in our enrollment. I'd like to see us get to 25,000.

 

[fourthandshort]

ISU publishes this data.

Student Enrollment Reports | Planning, Research and Policy Analysis | Illinois State

prpa.illinoisstate.edu

saw that, but didn't see it all on one page side by side

 

[Birddog]

I think if you look at total enrollments for all 4 classes, it is relatively flat. Not as sure whether that is for undergrad or total. But Ive seen mostly flat total numbers. Here is one source showing 2012-21: Illinois State University | Data USA

2023 was up to 20,989 .. which is highest since at least 2012, but not by much. More to the point, we are doing much better than all IL public schools, other than U of I, and maybe UIC .. but that is commuter school. 2021 was a recent low point, but that would likely have been a pandemic related hit.

University	Illinois State University
Sum of Enrollment	Column Labels
Row Labels	Full time	Part time	Grand Total
2012	18,309	2,397	20,706
2013	17,864	2,408	20,272
2014	18,219	2,396	20,615
2015	18,290	2,470	20,760
2016	18,694	2,345	21,039
2017	18,368	2,416	20,784
2018	18,207	2,428	20,635
2019	18,467	2,411	20,878
2020	18,043	2,677	20,720
2021	17,733	2,500	20,233
Grand Total	182194​	24448​	206642​

In the current Midwest demographic landscape and given what is happening with enrollment at similar institutions in the region, flat enrollment should be seen as equivalent to growth.

 

[Redbirdwarrior]

I think it is important to note that enrollment isnt flat at 21,000 because nobody is applying, it is flat at 21,000 because there are literally no more seats or beds to put students in. Look at the stats of what it takes to get INTO ISU now. Half of us alums would have never gotten our acceptance letter if we applied in 2024. You now have to have a 3.0+ GPA, like a 26 on your ACT and a list of extracurriculars.

ISU is turning AWAY more students than ever.

Now, when the Engineering college gets moving, enrollment will move from 21000 to close to 23000, but growth is not always about asses in seats, it is about asses that want to be in seats.

 

[ChiRedbirdfan]

I think if you look at total enrollments for all 4 classes, it is relatively flat. Not as sure whether that is for undergrad or total. But Ive seen mostly flat total numbers. Here is one source showing 2012-21: Illinois State University | Data USA

2023 was up to 20,989 .. which is highest since at least 2012, but not by much. More to the point, we are doing much better than all IL public schools, other than U of I, and maybe UIC .. but that is commuter school. 2021 was a recent low point, but that would likely have been a pandemic related hit.

University	Illinois State University
Sum of Enrollment	Column Labels
Row Labels	Full time	Part time	Grand Total
2012	18,309	2,397	20,706
2013	17,864	2,408	20,272
2014	18,219	2,396	20,615
2015	18,290	2,470	20,760
2016	18,694	2,345	21,039
2017	18,368	2,416	20,784
2018	18,207	2,428	20,635
2019	18,467	2,411	20,878
2020	18,043	2,677	20,720
2021	17,733	2,500	20,233
Grand Total	182194​	24448​	206642​

My aging memory says ISU enrollment was 21 or 22,000 thousand when I was on campus in the mid 80’s. Not certain of the components but it seems isu has hovered in the 21,000 range for at least the past 30 years.

 

[ChiRedbirdfan]

I think it is important to note that enrollment isnt flat at 21,000 because nobody is applying, it is flat at 21,000 because there are literally no more seats or beds to put students in. Look at the stats of what it takes to get INTO ISU now. Half of us alums would have never gotten our acceptance letter if we applied in 2024. You now have to have a 3.0+ GPA, like a 26 on your ACT and a list of extracurriculars.

ISU is turning AWAY more students than ever.

Now, when the Engineering college gets moving, enrollment will move from 21000 to close to 23000, but growth is not always about asses in seats, it is about asses that want to be in seats.

Enrollment growth for the “good” universities is definitely planned and stair stepped.

 

[fourthandshort]

Enrollment growth for the “good” universities is definitely planned and stair stepped.

now that we've dissected this trend line and determined it is likely deliberately flat .. it kind of begs the question, why wouldn't a successful university not already be stair-stepping some growth .. even if controlled ?

Are they carefully prepping to add some professional degrees and making sure they create "classroom and campus capacity" very carefully.

 

[ISUBU]

ISU enrollment has been about the same level for decades. At least 20 years ago ISU pointed out that our state funding per student was the lowest among state universities within Illinois. Tuition alone did not cover the costs, and the state wouldn't increase its funding. So adding more students wouldn't work financially unless tuition was dramatically increased - an approach the politicians wouldn't support. So the chosen path was to maintain enrollment around 20K, as it was the sweet spot given state funding and tuition dollars and costs. It was done on purpose.

Now we're facing a declining number of 18 year olds, fierce competition from other states for Illinois students, and very soon a demographic cliff. Our board needs to make the choices that are optimal for ISU, and the state needs to increase its support to reduce the financial incentive to go out of state. I see four schools really thriving. Two traditional (18 year olds and residential) in UIUC and ISU, and two highly commuter and greater number of students over 25 (SIUE and UIC). Everyone else is very niche or in decline. Practically speaking, this is a tough environment demographically, politically and financially to significantly increase our student body.

 

[Redbirdwarrior]

now that we've dissected this trend line and determined it is likely deliberately flat .. it kind of begs the question, why wouldn't a successful university not already be stair-stepping some growth .. even if controlled ?

Are they carefully prepping to add some professional degrees and making sure they create "classroom and campus capacity" very carefully.

Higher Ed is a brutal beast in 2024. Getting into college is hard. Paying for college is hard. Hiring for colleges is hard. Finding funding for colleges is hard. Getting the state to actually send you the money that they constitutionally owe you is hard.

Running a major university is a big BIG operation and big operations must grow smartly, not quickly. The engineering school has been in the works for 10 years and is now coming to fruition, which is about the pace things should be. I'd like to see ISU do a law program and much more with computer science in time, but growing smartly is key.

Further, e-learning has become a necessary component of every university in the country. Schools like Central Florida have seen enrollments grow to over 90,000 by utilizing online coursework aggressively. I don't think that is what ISU wants to be. I think the Board of Regents and President believe that college is more than the concepts you learn in the class and more the person you become when put into a new scenario. I think we can all say that our time at ISU crafted more about who we are today than just what we do from 9-5. There is learning that happens between the lines and I think ISU understands that.

I expect that in the next 15 years, ISU will have a total enrollment of somewhere in the 30,000 range and have an FBS football program. I think the admissions standards will be similar, at that point, to University of Illinois than SIUC and I feel there will still be 3 applications for every available seat.

The school is growing and evolving and doing so at a time when so many others are dying. Western IL, I think, will be out of business by 2035. They have an enrollment of 7200, down from 9400 just 7 years ago. SIUC has only 8000 undergrads.

We are in good shape.

 

[isuquinndog]

I think a growth point that they have used in Computer Science is eSports. We have one of the best eSports teams in the nation, which has been going strong now for a few years. I would hope it is paying dividends maybe not in number of students but in quality of students.

 

[fourthandshort]

Higher Ed is a brutal beast in 2024. Getting into college is hard. Paying for college is hard. Hiring for colleges is hard. Finding funding for colleges is hard. Getting the state to actually send you the money that they constitutionally owe you is hard.

Running a major university is a big BIG operation and big operations must grow smartly, not quickly. The engineering school has been in the works for 10 years and is now coming to fruition, which is about the pace things should be. I'd like to see ISU do a law program and much more with computer science in time, but growing smartly is key.

Further, e-learning has become a necessary component of every university in the country. Schools like Central Florida have seen enrollments grow to over 90,000 by utilizing online coursework aggressively. I don't think that is what ISU wants to be. I think the Board of Regents and President believe that college is more than the concepts you learn in the class and more the person you become when put into a new scenario. I think we can all say that our time at ISU crafted more about who we are today than just what we do from 9-5. There is learning that happens between the lines and I think ISU understands that.

I expect that in the next 15 years, ISU will have a total enrollment of somewhere in the 30,000 range and have an FBS football program. I think the admissions standards will be similar, at that point, to University of Illinois than SIUC and I feel there will still be 3 applications for every available seat.

The school is growing and evolving and doing so at a time when so many others are dying. Western IL, I think, will be out of business by 2035. They have an enrollment of 7200, down from 9400 just 7 years ago. SIUC has only 8000 undergrads.

We are in good shape.

well stated and sensible !!

 

[Redbird60451]

I think a growth point that they have used in Computer Science is eSports. We have one of the best eSports teams in the nation, which has been going strong now for a few years. I would hope it is paying dividends maybe not in number of students but in quality of students.

They should still grow the Computer Science more. Maybe go heavy into Cyber Security, even more than they already have. Maybe get noticed by the government and get extra funds there.

 

[cubird]

ISU should do more certificate type offerings for grads wanting to upgrade their skill set in their field of work.

 

[ChiRedbirdfan]

Higher Ed is a brutal beast in 2024. Getting into college is hard. Paying for college is hard. Hiring for colleges is hard. Finding funding for colleges is hard. Getting the state to actually send you the money that they constitutionally owe you is hard.

Running a major university is a big BIG operation and big operations must grow smartly, not quickly. The engineering school has been in the works for 10 years and is now coming to fruition, which is about the pace things should be. I'd like to see ISU do a law program and much more with computer science in time, but growing smartly is key.

Further, e-learning has become a necessary component of every university in the country. Schools like Central Florida have seen enrollments grow to over 90,000 by utilizing online coursework aggressively. I don't think that is what ISU wants to be. I think the Board of Regents and President believe that college is more than the concepts you learn in the class and more the person you become when put into a new scenario. I think we can all say that our time at ISU crafted more about who we are today than just what we do from 9-5. There is learning that happens between the lines and I think ISU understands that.

I expect that in the next 15 years, ISU will have a total enrollment of somewhere in the 30,000 range and have an FBS football program. I think the admissions standards will be similar, at that point, to University of Illinois than SIUC and I feel there will still be 3 applications for every available seat.

The school is growing and evolving and doing so at a time when so many others are dying. Western IL, I think, will be out of business by 2035. They have an enrollment of 7200, down from 9400 just 7 years ago. SIUC has only 8000 undergrads.

We are in good shape.

WIU wishes they had 7200 enrollment. They are under 4200 full time for the macomb campus this spring. Add in grad students and they are under 5200. The drop in enrollment has been staggering and problematic but the damage to their reputation is likely magnified by the approach of basically letting anyone who applied the past several years enroll at the university. The quality of their student body may be more problematic then the lack of quantity of students.

Spring 2024 Enrollment - Leatherneck Nation

www.leathernecknation.net

 

[ChiRedbirdfan]

WIU wishes they had 7200 enrollment. They are under 4200 full time for the macomb campus this spring. Add in grad students and they are under 5200. The drop in enrollment has been staggering and problematic but the damage to their reputation is likely magnified by the approach of basically letting anyone who applied the past several years enroll at the university. The quality of their student body may be more problematic then the lack of quantity of students.

Spring 2024 Enrollment - Leatherneck Nation

www.leathernecknation.net

I actually OVERSTATED WIU’s Macomb spring undergrad enrollment. Their full time undergraduate enrollment is 3400! With grad students they hit 4200 full time in macomb.