A letter from AD Beggs on NIL

Birdfriend72

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 6, 2017
Messages
1,929
I was in an admin office when the news came down that ISU was cutting men's wrestling and men's soccer due to TitleIX. Very very somber day&week with tears shed from some surprising people. These were GOOD programs.

I get where ChiRedbirdfan is coming from, I do. A lot of good hard working kids (many excellent students, btw) who are in non revenue sports...but they are still chasin' after it. I would NOT want to be the one who makes that call, looks those kids in the eye, and breaks their hearts.

At least, if that comes to pass...The Prez, AD, and BOT ought to be there to look them in the eye.
Give them a day and time. It doesn't have to be immediate. That allows them to transfer/figure it out. I think our football budget is like a million dollars more than basketball. I saw Drake has a 1.3 million football budget and a 3.3 mil basketball budget. The fact that our football budget is more than our basketball budget makes 0 sense. I would swap that around.
 

cubird

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 19, 2017
Messages
2,388
Not all non revenue sports have full scholarships Eastern IL surprisingly has a lot of sports for a college its size. However, they make up for some revenue by having some participants subsidizing their sport which means paying some or all their tuition.
 

Hamdonger

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 17, 2017
Messages
6,501
Not all non revenue sports have full scholarships Eastern IL surprisingly has a lot of sports for a college its size. However, they make up for some revenue by having some participants subsidizing their sport which means paying some or all their tuition.
Most don't. At least at our school.
 

cpacmel

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 16, 2017
Messages
3,880
I think our football budget is like a million dollars more than basketball. I saw Drake has a 1.3 million football budget and a 3.3 mil basketball budget. The fact that our football budget is more than our basketball budget makes 0 sense. I would swap that around.

Doesn't our football team have to fund 63 scholarships compared to 13 for basketball? 50 more scholarships.....

The reason Drake has 2 mil more for basketball over football is Drake football is non-scholarship.
 

Birdfriend72

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 6, 2017
Messages
1,929

Doesn't our football team have to fund 63 scholarships compared to 13 for basketball? 50 more scholarships.....

The reason Drake has 2 mil more for basketball over football is Drake football is non-scholarship.
Our football team doesn’t have to do anything! It spends what one wants to spend on it! But, if you want the program to continue to have a higher budget than a possible program that could make a decent profit- keep going in the same direction. Wichita or Bradley doesn’t have to spend a dime on football. I’m not saying we get rid of football- just saying spending more than basketball is insane!
 

ChiRedbirdfan

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 17, 2017
Messages
6,597
Our football team doesn’t have to do anything! It spends what one wants to spend on it! But, if you want the program to continue to have a higher budget than a possible program that could make a decent profit- keep going in the same direction. Wichita or Bradley doesn’t have to spend a dime on football. I’m not saying we get rid of football- just saying spending more than basketball is insane!
Agree with your last sentence as respects to fcs football. The more I study ISU’s value proposition as respects to FCS football and the related expenses it makes no sense. With scholarship FCS there is virtually little to no upside to the university as respects to a marketing boost from media exposure, no image enhancement from being associated with similar or more prestigious academic institutions, very little if any increase in athletic department revenue from enhanced licensing or naming rights, little to no deeper alumni relations developed which can help with athletic department donations but more importantly with enhanced alumni donations and university involvement..etc. We avoid nearly all the upside of fbs football while we fund/tax our students at the level of low level end of fbs athletic departments. In the past fcs had more significance to it but the fcs landscape is different and less meaningless due to several factors. I get why there has been and continues to be a constant exodus from fcs to fbs. Peeps here may not agree but fcs football is viewed by a high percentage of people/sports fans as either d2 or d3 football as they only know it is something less than the highest level.

Bringing it back to basketball agree 100 percent that it is insane for Isu to spend more on fcs football than the men’s basketball program, imo. ISU should go pioneer form fcs or move up and reap some of the additional upsides that exist at fbs. Alternatively go pioneer route and lets pump those former football resources into mens/women’s basketball and women’s volleyball where we can reap some name recognition from our athletics on a national basis consistent with our national academic standing. I know this is not a popular take, I don’t like it either, but damn we got to start doing some things differently with our athletics from a strategic standpoint. Our athletic status quo is not working as respects to enhancing our university and returns will continue to diminish if we don’t become more laser focused. That is my take and I will be the first to welcome and consider other opinions/ideas even if the opinion is why we should maintain status quo.
 

StLRedbird

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 26, 2017
Messages
2,005
Agree with your last sentence as respects to fcs football. The more I study ISU’s value proposition as respects to FCS football and the related expenses it makes no sense. With scholarship FCS there is virtually little to no upside to the university as respects to a marketing boost from media exposure, no image enhancement from being associated with similar or more prestigious academic institutions, very little if any increase in athletic department revenue from enhanced licensing or naming rights, little to no deeper alumni relations developed which can help with athletic department donations but more importantly with enhanced alumni donations and university involvement..etc. We avoid nearly all the upside of fbs football while we fund/tax our students at the level of low level end of fbs athletic departments. In the past fcs had more significance to it but the fcs landscape is different and less meaningless due to several factors. I get why there has been and continues to be a constant exodus from fcs to fbs. Peeps here may not agree but fcs football is viewed by a high percentage of people/sports fans as either d2 or d3 football as they only know it is something less than the highest level.

Bringing it back to basketball agree 100 percent that it is insane for Isu to spend more on fcs football than the men’s basketball program, imo. ISU should go pioneer form fcs or move up and reap some of the additional upsides that exist at fbs. Alternatively go pioneer route and lets pump those former football resources into mens/women’s basketball and women’s volleyball where we can reap some name recognition from our athletics on a national basis consistent with our national academic standing. I know this is not a popular take, I don’t like it either, but damn we got to start doing some things differently with our athletics from a strategic standpoint. Our athletic status quo is not working as respects to enhancing our university and returns will continue to diminish if we don’t become more laser focused. That is my take and I will be the first to welcome and consider other opinions/ideas even if the opinion is why we should maintain status quo.
Agree with all of that except downgrading football. It is the only sport that matters in today's world. Funding an FCS football program more than MBB is a head scratcher to me - the only rational reason for doing that is if you're planning an upgrade to FBS, which we don't appear to be serious about.

I understand and share a love for the MBB program. Most of my dearest sports memories at ISU were driven by that team over the years. But times change and so have I. The spring scrimmage is 1pm Sat and the weather will be gorgeous.
 

Birdfriend72

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 6, 2017
Messages
1,929
Agree with all of that except downgrading football. It is the only sport that matters in today's world. Funding an FCS football program more than MBB is a head scratcher to me - the only rational reason for doing that is if you're planning an upgrade to FBS, which we don't appear to be serious about.

I understand and share a love for the MBB program. Most of my dearest sports memories at ISU were driven by that team over the years. But times change and so have I. The spring scrimmage is 1pm Sat and the weather will be gorgeous.
Agree that it matters. If you have no goal in site then don’t tax a sport that clearly is ready for the challenge!
 

ChiRedbirdfan

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 17, 2017
Messages
6,597
Agree with all of that except downgrading football. It is the only sport that matters in today's world. Funding an FCS football program more than MBB is a head scratcher to me - the only rational reason for doing that is if you're planning an upgrade to FBS, which we don't appear to be serious about.

I understand and share a love for the MBB program. Most of my dearest sports memories at ISU were driven by that team over the years. But times change and so have I. The spring scrimmage is 1pm Sat and the weather will be gorgeous.
Btw I am not advocating for downgrading football rather just stating that it seems to make more sense for ISU to do something different than fcs, either up or down. IF we go up/fbs we can likely, over time, increase rights/licensing by anywhere from around a million a year to as much as 3 million a year based upon what Mac schools achieve from annual rights/licensing that exceeds ISU’s current rights/licensing. I believe the university could also demand more $$ from p5 buy games as well as receive more media exposure.

If we go down than we save significant expenses that can be used to boost/enhance other sports that could benefit the universities image/marketing/funsraising.

Any transition will not be easy and revenue enhancements or expense reductions are not immediate, so the short term gains will be unremarkable, but impact could become significant long term. Lastly none of this matters if new university leadership has bigger priorities than spending time/energy on Isu athletics.
 
Last edited:

StLRedbird

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 26, 2017
Messages
2,005
Agree that it matters. If you have no goal in site then don’t tax a sport that clearly is ready for the challenge!
The convention wisdom around here is that we have a goldilocks situation - just right. That is, the MVC/MVFC is right-sized to our means. But I see it as more of a value trap, or maybe road to nowhere. Even if we succeed, what does it get us? We still have an FCS ball and chain around our ankle.
 

StLRedbird

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 26, 2017
Messages
2,005
Btw I am not advocating for downgrading football rather just stating that it seems to make more sense for ISU to do something different than fcs, either up or down. IF we go up/fbs we can likely, over time, increase rights/licensing by anywhere from around a million a year to as much as 3 million a year based upon what Mac schools achieve from annual rights/licensing that exceeds ISU’s current rights/licensing. I believe the university could also demand more $$ from p5 buy games as well as receive more media exposure.

If we go down than we save significant expenses that can be used to boost/enhance other sports that could benefit the universities image/marketing/funsraising.

Any transition will not be easy and revenue enhancements or expense reductions are not immediate, so the short term gains will be unremarkable, but impact could become significant long term. Lastly none of this matters if new university leadership has bigger priorities than spending time/energy on Isu athletics.
Understood. Not a fan of the status quo, myself. Your revenue estimation sounds spot on to me.
 

isuquinndog

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Jul 16, 2017
Messages
7,295
Location
Redbird Country
What is more likely if we move....

1. FBS increases our income and revenue and makes all of ISU better
2. We completely fail in FBS, can't win a games and we so no real difference other than we are on ESPN every Tuesday losing
 
B

BirdGrad2011

Guest
What is more likely if we move....

1. FBS increases our income and revenue and makes all of ISU better
2. We completely fail in FBS, can't win a games and we so no real difference other than we are on ESPN every Tuesday losing
We’ve already shown we can compete. We’ve beaten FBS teams (Northwestern, Colorado State, Eastern Michigan). The difference between MVFC and MAC isn’t that great where we’d be a joke.
 

StLRedbird

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 26, 2017
Messages
2,005
What is more likely if we move....

1. FBS increases our income and revenue and makes all of ISU better
2. We completely fail in FBS, can't win a games and we so no real difference other than we are on ESPN every Tuesday losing
I don't think either path presents a primrose lane. But I like our chances better down the MAC path than the MVC/MVFC one. I also think any fair accounting of the pros and cons gets any reasonable man to where I'm at. Open your mind to the possibility. First time I heard the MAC mentioned seriously at ISU, it came out of Zenger's mouth and I shuddered. Took me probably another 10 yrs to completely open my mind. Red-White scrimmage is 1pm Sat. Weather will be beautiful.
 

Birdfriend72

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 6, 2017
Messages
1,929
We’ve already shown we can compete. We’ve beaten FBS teams (Northwestern, Colorado State, Eastern Michigan). The difference between MVFC and MAC isn’t that great where we’d be a joke.
Actually, the MAC had a few teams play in bowl games. A few of them had 2 million dollar payouts. That's not a joke. Bowling Greens budget was 6.9 Mil and played in a bowl. Before you make fun of it- its better than what we did this year with our 4.7 mil budget.
 
B

BirdGrad2011

Guest
Actually, the MAC had a few teams play in bowl games. A few of them had 2 million dollar payouts. That's not a joke. Bowling Greens budget was 6.9 Mil and played in a bowl. Before you make fun of it- its better than what we did this year with our 4.7 mil budget.
I wasn’t calling the MAC a joke. I was saying we wouldn’t be so far behind that we wouldn’t be an 0-12 joke program.
 

ChiRedbirdfan

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 17, 2017
Messages
6,597
Some more data to chew on:

First number is annual atheltic department revenue for 2022 (NCAA Finances: Revenue & Expenses by School - USA TODAY) and second number is annual rights/licensing:

Buffalo. $40,192,000. $4,149,000
W Mich. $39,100,000. $4,494,000
C Mich. $39,000,000. $4,107,000
Miami. $38,076,000. $4,539,000
Toledo. $35,603,000. $5,553,000
E Michi. $33,041,000. $4,569,000
Akron. $30,498,000 $3,996,000
Mo St. $29,916,000. $2,562,000
REDBIRDS $29,900,000. $2,977,000
Ohio. $29,335,000. $5,090,000
Ball St. $28,804,000. $3,698,000
NDSU. $29,295,000. $4,971,000
Kent St. $28,605,000. $4,190,000
Bowl Gr. $25,575,000. $4,287,000
NIU. $22,177,000. $3,689,000
SIU. $18,739,000. $3,655,000
In St $18,656,000. $1,517,000
Murray St $18,598,000. $1,719,000
UIC. $18,193,000. $1,477,000
N. Iowa. $17,603,000. $3,200,000

will provide some commentary later. tired of typing. Looking forward to other's observation and thoughts.

Edit…the first thing that jumps out to me is the athletic department revenue disparity between the MAC and the MVC/MVFC combo. Lumping all the public’s together leaves MAC with the top 7 and the MVCs with the bottom 5 and thr magnitude of difference from top to bottom is so significant. It was not that long ago when I felt the MVC was clearly a superior conference. Currently I believe there is a fair argument to be made that the MAC has already bypassed the MVC, without even factoring in the recent addition of UMASS. Regardless there is no way the MVC will be able to hang around given the revenue disparity. MAC is a football conf and MVC/MVFC combo is a basketball first and football second conference. Football is the driving force in college athletics and we are on the wrong side of history. We need to make some serious adjustments one way or another, IMO.

Another thought is that the pinnacle of fcs, ndsu, with their devoted followers and dominance of fcs, is on par with MAC rights-licensing revenue. Given that the bison are basically the only game in the state and they have won damn near every fcs championship for a decade I was surprised their rights/licensing was not higher than all MAC schools.

Additionally, hats off to UNI. Despite a much small enrollment than ISU, a fairly lower academic ranking, and a significantly lower athletic budget …their football and basketball teams have basically dominated ISU THE PAST 25 years as measured by post season results. How can we replicate that winning culture that UNi has demonstrated ? Further , despite being disadvantaged as compared to ISU their athletic brand is stronger as measured by the amount of rights/licensing revenue.
 
Last edited:
Top Bottom