What if ISU joined the CUSA?

Yogi

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That is just the way it is done takes big money to be fbs some one has to pay most of the students get no benefit falls to the fans
 

CaliRdBrd

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Why should the school pay for something that students may not want?
Ok, fine. A bit shortsighted since they'd be overlooking the power a successful sports program has regarding enrollment, but OK.

I know 'Bama is a bit of an outlier, but many successful sports programs experience the same successes (albeit on a smaller scale). However, before Saban's success, they were a below average school (academically). I believe their football program now brings in $200 million/year of which a large portion is geared toward academics and has steered them towards an elite level, across the board:
  • Enrollment is up 55% since 2015.
  • Donations (mostly due to the success of football) at a record $106 million (in 2019)
  • $16 million + in scholarships are now available, thus attracting a higher caliber student
  • improved infrastructure
  • new additions to the nursing school
  • additions to the math and science department
  • better housing for students and faculty
  • in all actuality, the recent renovations too numerous to list
I personally have multiple friends in IL that have kids at 'Bama. That was unheard of 20 years ago.

In other words, a successful sports program floats all boats. To not realize this is, at the most rudimentary level, incompetent.
 

Yogi

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you really bring up bama as your example what are you smoking cali I would love to isu succeed I would lovw to see us move up but lets win in the valley first
 

CaliRdBrd

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you really bring up bama as your example what are you smoking cali I would love to isu succeed I would lovw to see us move up but lets win in the valley first
Maybe you missed this sentence...

I know 'Bama is a bit of an outlier, but many successful sports programs experience the same successes (albeit on a smaller scale)

Not smoking anything, but I highly recommend this book i just finished about how the surfing culture basically introduced weed to the states....

Amazon product

Super interesting.
 

Seven

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If everybody had the money of Alabama, they would be spending it.

It’s not that ISU and 250-300 other schools simultaneously don’t want to spend on athletics or are “incompetent”. It’s they don’t have the access to that kind of money.

Comparing Alabama to ISU is completely misunderstanding economics at a 101 level.
 

gobirds85

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Ok, fine. A bit shortsighted since they'd be overlooking the power a successful sports program has regarding enrollment, but OK.

I know 'Bama is a bit of an outlier, but many successful sports programs experience the same successes (albeit on a smaller scale). However, before Saban's success, they were a below average school (academically). I believe their football program now brings in $200 million/year of which a large portion is geared toward academics and has steered them towards an elite level, across the board:
  • Enrollment is up 55% since 2015.
  • Donations (mostly due to the success of football) at a record $106 million (in 2019)
  • $16 million + in scholarships are now available, thus attracting a higher caliber student
  • improved infrastructure
  • new additions to the nursing school
  • additions to the math and science department
  • better housing for students and faculty
  • in all actuality, the recent renovations too numerous to list
I personally have multiple friends in IL that have kids at 'Bama. That was unheard of 20 years ago.

In other words, a successful sports program floats all boats. To not realize this is, at the most rudimentary level, incompetent.

The state of Illinois is the #2 state when it comes to exporting students across state lines. The pool of Illinois HS students is very enticing to schools all over the country, but the SEC schools need these students. These are very large schools and they need to fill seats.

My youngest went to Kentucky and spent her four years in hs being a decent student, but far from spectacular. KY gave her/us schollie of $7,500 a year. Insane. Three of her four roommates for the last two years were from Illinois. Her freshman year roommate was from Illinois. Bama allows free tuition for any student who scores a 32 or higher on their SAT. These large schools are feeling the pinch of technology (online courses) and competition in a shrinking pool of talent and due to these factors, they are offering up YUGE deals to get kids to enroll. We can joke and laugh all we want about the northern HS student v the southern HS student, but the proof is in the pudding.

The tail wags the dog and students want to go to schools where athletics are strong and winning is a priority. Everyone loves a winner.
 
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isuquinndog

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I understand you have to spend money to have athletics like that, and it can be advantageous. I would argue that if the MVC could get a TV deal like these conferences that we would be having a much different conversation. To over look the TENS OF MILLIONS of free dollars coming into each school for doing nothing other than playing in a conference they happened to already be in, for the most part, is shortsighted.
 

FriscoBird90

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The state of Illinois is the #2 state when it comes to exporting students across state lines. The pool of Illinois HS students is very enticing to schools all over the country, but the SEC schools need these students. These are very large schools and they need to fill seats.

My youngest went to Kentucky and spent her four years in hs being a decent student, but far from spectacular. KY gave her/us schollie of $7,500 a year. Insane. Three of her four roommates for the last two years were from Illinois. Her freshman year roommate was from Illinois. Bama allows free tuition for any student who scores a 32 or higher on their SAT. These large schools are feeling the pinch of technology (online courses) and competition in a shrinking pool of talent and due to these factors, they are offering up YUGE deals to get kids to enroll. We can joke and laugh all we want about the northern HS school v the southern HS student, but the proof is in the pudding.

The tail wags the dog and students want to go to schools where athletics are strong and winning is a priority. Everyone loves a winner.
States such as Illinois need to recognize the brain drain among the college student population to schools in other states and why it is happening. The University of Arkansas has a program where students from neighboring states can receive a 70%, 80%, or 90% discount off the difference between in-state and out-of-state tuition, depending upon a student's high school GPA and/or ACT scores. Once on campus the student has to maintain a reasonable GPA (2.75 or higher) in order to keep the reduced tuition. A couple of years ago UArk expanded the program to include students from the states of Georgia and Illinois; Chicago and Atlanta are closer to Fayetteville than is El Paso, TX. UArk is expected to have a record-setting sized incoming freshman class for fall 2022. Having a quality bowl-worthy football team, an Elite 8 men's basketball team, membership in the SEC, and an attractive campus will help do that for a school's enrollment numbers. One of our children just finished his first year at UArk and loves being a Razorback. We love the fact he qualifies for the 90% reduction, which means his renewable, reduced out-of-state tuition for a full academic year is approximately $3500 less per year than the current in-state tuition at Illinois State University. Woo Pig Sooie! 🐗
 

Birddog

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Interesting sports=increased enrollment discussion here. Illinois is well aware of the student export problem, it is not new. What’s at play here are a lot of students want the “big time” college experience and the only place to find that in Illinois is at U of I which prices many of those students out which pushes them to other states.

However, it is not successful sports alone, if that were true NIU would have seen a boost since the orange bowl, instead it has severely shrunk to an enrollment smaller than ISU while ISU has maintained, which is a real testament to the work the university does and to our location, not to our athletic prowess.

Illinois has seen a drop in high school graduates for several years and universities are preparing for an additional upcoming “enrollment cliff” as it was described to me recently.

Unless ISU were to suddenly and miraculously become a P5 school, enrollment will be determined by many factors, the least of which is athletics.
 

Redbird222

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The first driver was that Illinois public universities have/had some of the highest in -state tuition costs.

Second there were/are so many other states' public universities offering sizeable relief to out of state students in various forms.

The result is/has been it's very easy to find several choices where attending a school out of state is actually more affordable than attending an Illinois public university. It's much easier for parents to say yes when the cost is at parity or better. This has been happening for well over 15 years.

The problem gets worse for the state as enrollment declines the cost per student goes up. So what do you do ... raise tuition/fees or stop funding certain programs. The state was short sighted for a long time and did nothing to combat this issue. The better weather, tremendous activities, and better facilities are all icing on the cake.
 

Aggie

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All kinds of costs tend to be higher in Illinois due to many reasons. From pensions ( not knocking them I have one) to demographics, etc. all add up. Friend had two kids one went to Iowa other one to Iowa State. Both at a price cheaper than they could attend Western Illinois. They live 45 minutes from MaComb. Murray State is eating southern up. I have other friends with children going to Alabama, Ole Miss, LSU. List goes on and on, all at a cheaper rate.
Think biggest thing I saw on public costs comparing a town in Illinois, either Rockford or Peoria to Friscoe, Texas. Illinois town was paying like 140 retired police officers a pension. Friscoe which is just now really growing was paying 2. Demographics just killing our costs. Outside of the suburbs Illinois Is downsizing rapidly. Just look what is happening 30 miles down 55 in Lincoln. Ureka college also in trouble they say. ISU so far doing a good job staying ahead of this, but an economic downturn really going to pinch.
Worse thing about all the kids leaving, very few will ever come back. It starts to feed on itself. I think in a way the state in many areas has to forget about growth and worry about smart downsizing. Look at Rivian stock. Big new hot thing has went from a high above $170 to $20 today. Lots of wealth destruction. Last point, as the kids leave, then get married, then have kids, eventually Grandparents leave to be with grandkids. So point is not having a competitive price point for a college education in your state can have multiple economic consequences.
 

CaliRdBrd

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If everybody had the money of Alabama, they would be spending it.

It’s not that ISU and 250-300 other schools simultaneously don’t want to spend on athletics or are “incompetent”. It’s they don’t have the access to that kind of money.

Comparing Alabama to ISU is completely misunderstanding economics at a 101 level.
No one is comparing ISU to Bama.
 

CaliRdBrd

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Interesting sports=increased enrollment discussion here. Illinois is well aware of the student export problem, it is not new. What’s at play here are a lot of students want the “big time” college experience and the only place to find that in Illinois is at U of I which prices many of those students out which pushes them to other states.

However, it is not successful sports alone, if that were true NIU would have seen a boost since the orange bowl, instead it has severely shrunk to an enrollment smaller than ISU while ISU has maintained, which is a real testament to the work the university does and to our location, not to our athletic prowess.

Illinois has seen a drop in high school graduates for several years and universities are preparing for an additional upcoming “enrollment cliff” as it was described to me recently.

Unless ISU were to suddenly and miraculously become a P5 school, enrollment will be determined by many factors, the least of which is athletics.
NIU isn’t experiencing the growth other successful sports schools are because the success has to be sustained for several years.
I’ll bet they did see an increase in enrollment the year after their Orange Bowl appearance. Im just too lazy to look it up. Gotta go catch some waves:)
 

Bird Friend

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NIU isn’t experiencing the growth other successful sports schools are because the success has to be sustained for several years.
I’ll bet they did see an increase in enrollment the year after their Orange Bowl appearance. Im just too lazy to look it up. Gotta go catch some waves:)
NIU’s enrollment increased in 2020. That was the first year it had increased since 2008. So the Orange Bowl did nothing.

 

jwa123

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Ok, fine. A bit shortsighted since they'd be overlooking the power a successful sports program has regarding enrollment, but OK.

I know 'Bama is a bit of an outlier, but many successful sports programs experience the same successes (albeit on a smaller scale). However, before Saban's success, they were a below average school (academically). I believe their football program now brings in $200 million/year of which a large portion is geared toward academics and has steered them towards an elite level, across the board:
  • Enrollment is up 55% since 2015.
  • Donations (mostly due to the success of football) at a record $106 million (in 2019)
  • $16 million + in scholarships are now available, thus attracting a higher caliber student
  • improved infrastructure
  • new additions to the nursing school
  • additions to the math and science department
  • better housing for students and faculty
  • in all actuality, the recent renovations too numerous to list
I personally have multiple friends in IL that have kids at 'Bama. That was unheard of 20 years ago.

In other words, a successful sports program floats all boats. To not realize this is, at the most rudimentary level, incompetent.
Using Alabama is a straw man argument.
 

CaliRdBrd

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If everybody had the money of Alabama, they would be spending it.

It’s not that ISU and 250-300 other schools simultaneously don’t want to spend on athletics or are “incompetent”. It’s they don’t have the access to that kind of money.

Comparing Alabama to ISU is completely misunderstanding economics at a 101 level.
Serious question, is there a different version of redbirdfan.net where those that comment actually have to read the entire statement on which they’re commenting about?
 

Yogi

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no one reads the entire thing or like me i am old and type slow so I forget half of what I read
 
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