Scrimmage

[ricohill]

Any thoughts after today?

 

[fourthandshort]

Random thoughts:

1. defense must be ahead of offense .. which I'm fine with, they're very good and this is usually the case anyway .. plus they know our plays like the back of their hand.

2. why no stats for 2nd string QB Jefferson ... injured or demoted ?

3. How can we be sure Jame Robinson is still on this team .... season is here, time to take him out of the offseason bubble, you think maybe ??

4. Can't wait to see Proctor in real game

5. Good obvious choices of captains

 

[Total Red]

Robinson and Jefferson are doing fine. The scrimmage was a chance to look at other players.

https://www.pantagraph.com/sports/college/football/freshman-rutkiewicz-continues-to-impress-for-redbirds/article_6f0dd3df-a9bc-508e-b0c9-1abf2d3d5fc7.html

 

[Total Red]

Any thoughts after today?

Yes

 

[Total Red]

Any thoughts after today?

Oh, maybe you want to know what they are.

Coming in to August camp I expected the running back/fullback position (Robinson/Proctor, McCoyn) to be Championship level. I expected the same for the Defensive line (McKnight, Ridgeway, Lewan and Clark). Those expectations have been met. I wasn't ready to put the D-secondary on the Championship pedestal due to key losses (Willie Edwards, Mithcell Brees)but I'm ready to add them to the list. Capt. Kirk and Devin Taylor rec'd preseason recognition. That's good, I hope opponents underestimate our other corner. Charles Woods is really good. Long, fluid and fast, Woods can also return the ball on special teams. He's slender but he doesn't shy from contact so he should be a pleasure to watch.

That still leaves LB'ers, Off-Line, WR's, TE's, QB and special teams all rated below Championship level. That doesn't mean we're weak in those areas. It just means I don't get up and wave my pom-poms for every position group (like say #99 does). What is keeping each unit from achieving that level?

LB'ers - First it would help if we could get everyone healthy. Vandenburgh and Mends missed a lot of action during camp. Now they're back but Washington is out with a bad shoulder. We'll see who is fit for NIU. DeForest returns in the middle with Draka on his flank. DeForest had an impressive camp by anticipating and beating the offense to the spot. I wonder if his ability to maneuver to the right location will continue when he faces opponents he's less familiar with. DeForest and Draka also fall into the shorter stockier category. That's not necessarily a problem. Alejandro Rivera and Zack Matthews were lightly (if at all) recruited LB'ers that were on the short, stocky side. They each led the team in tackles. You can still win Championships with players like that, players that the NFL would never give a second look. Vandenburgh and Washington look more like what you would expect when you ask Central Casting to send over a "LB'er type" but they haven't put up big numbers yet. Draka and DeForest may be among the tackle leaders by the end of the season and maybe we'll say that their "short but not slow" mantra has taken them all the way to the Championship level.

Off-Line Once you past Himmelman most of the offensive line is better suited to run blocking than pass blocking. It's big but it could be more athletic and a lack of mobility can hurt in the ground game as well. It reminds me of the 1983 Meyer/Spivak O- line that was big on brawn. In the '83 opener against EIU the smaller but faster Panther defenders ran circles around them. They improved their execution after that and went on to a 6-4-1 season. That could happen again as big offensive lines wear well over the season and Coach Etheridge will be relentless in pursuit of improvement.

WR's (See LB'er - we need everyone healthy). Yesterday I saw Edgar, Blackman and Nagel on the sidelines but not on the field. Haley seniored up with a really nice TD grab. Everybody has made a great catch in camp but everybody has dropped a catchable pass as well so it remains to be seen if the consistency will be there. There's talent here but it's a young group. You say defense wins championships? I say players old enough to legally drink beer win championships. Veterans wins Championships. Rutkiewicz? Not only is he not old enough to drink he has a face that looks like jail bait for a U-High coed.

TE's - Three of the greatest lies of all-time. "I'm from the government and I'm here to help you." "I'll respect you in the morning." "We're going to throw to the TE more this year."
I've given this some thought and I've determined that TE's tend to be in the middle of the field and a lot of OC's don't want to throw over the middle with the increased chance of an over or underthrown pass being intercepted. We're deep at TE. I like them a lot but they're going to have to be a more productive unit to reach the Championship level. Go out and prove it.

Special teams - You found my blind spot. I actually find special teams rather boring until it comes time to kick a winning FG. They're extremely important. I know that but I don't know our personnel very well. I just know that the special teams were not as strong as we would have liked last season.

QB - Here's the biggie. It's very hard to play at Championship level without Championship level play at the QB position. The problem is that he can't do it on his own. He'll need help. He'll get help from his backfield mates. I have RB/FB at the Championship level but the Off-line, TE's and WR's have some concerns as stated above. Brady Davis is wearing the "occasionally brilliant but inconsistent label." He wants to be somewhere else next season. Maybe the FBS but more likely the NFL. Right now he's going to draw a big yawn with a 55% completion pct. It needs to be at least 60% and preferably 65% for a Championship level offense and it's hard to go up 10%. Even so Davis is a fountain of optimism. He has that swagger you like in your starting QB. There will be highs and lows along the way like last season but this offense could progress over the season and become a highly productive unit ready for playoff football. Davis looks a little bigger and stronger this season. His passes have lots of zip. He reminds me of Tre in that he wants this to be his team. He appears comfortable with high expectations and he creates them himself. He's ready to take things on his shoulders with all eyes on him and he takes the field down 6 points with less than 2 minutes to go. Sometimes you get what you ask for. This is his team and his opportunity to be great. The offense isn't perfect but the talent is there. If Davis plays at the Championship level the rest of the offense can and should rise to meet him there. It should as interesting as hell to watch.

 

[ISUBU]

Special teams - You found my blind spot. I actually find special teams rather boring until it comes time to kick a winning FG. They're extremely important. I know that but I don't know our personnel very well. I just know that the special teams were not as strong as we would have liked last season.

Puntiing was OK last year. Field goal kicking? That's another story.

In the final 9 games of the season (Colorado State on), we made one field goal of 28 yards or further. That's unbelievable. Our opponents? They made 7 . Of those, 2 were more than 30 yards and 5 were more than 40 yards. We basically had to get the ball all the way inside the 15 yard line to even consider a field goal.

So Fenlason hitting a 40 yard field goal in the scrimmage? That's where we need to be.

 

[Redbirds100]

Adding the College Sports Madness preview that came out today to this thread(sorry) -

https://www.collegesportsmadness.com/article/17723

 

[MadBird]

Good reports and analyses. I'm cautiously optimistic.

Total Red, you mention that the NFL won't spend much time on a 6'0 player, but you know, Roquan Smith looks pretty good in Blue and Orange these days and he's listed at 6'0. Not that anyone will mistake Deforest for Roquan, but I'll take those stocky guys plugging up those holes. I know you weren't dogging them.

Speaking of cautious optimism, WR bothers me some. The fact that a 5'8, 165 lb freshman has come in and grabbed some headlines makes for a good story, but I was hoping for more from last year's freshmen/redshirts. Maybe injuries are a factor here. Eric Rogers from E.St.Lous? Stephen Halusan from Milwaukee? Maybe Rutkiewicz is in the slot and those guys are on the outside? Anyway, concerns me that we may still be short of talent here. Need to get more from Haley and the Virginia transfer.

I'm a little on the bubble about our QB too, I don't like the fact that he might prefer to be elsewhere next year, maybe that's the way it is these days, but I hope there's no bad locker-room attitude about it. Everything I've heard and read so far indicates the team is with him, let's hope it stays that way. He isn't going to be anywhere else - power 5 or NFL - if he doesn't produce this year, so I spose we're all looking for the same thing for this year.

There's great opportunity for a few guys to be difference-makers this year - Proctor, Edgar/Haley/Blackman, Davis. The OL. I think the D will be fine, we have lots of horses there.

My football schedule (including DIII St. John's) is being torn up and stomped on, by weddings, HS reunion, etc. Will be at the home opener, then maybe not again until Homecoming? Am looking forward to playoff games to fill up my dance card!

 

[fourthandshort]

Got to keep this real ... This talk about Davis considering FBS or NFL for his 5th year would probably shock the rest of MVFC teams who played him last year. I hope that's just a silly rumor with zero basis in truth. Because Davis has a lot to prove this season before there's any more talk on this front.

So I suggest Davis focus on 2019 and FCS for now. I truly believe he could turn into a top 10 FCS QB ... if the planets align, maybe top 5 FCS QB. And one good FCS season will not do it for NFL scouts.

 

[Adunk33]

Got to keep this real ... This talk about Davis considering FBS or NFL for his 5th year would probably shock the rest of MVFC teams who played him last year. I hope that's just a silly rumor with zero basis in truth. Because Davis has a lot to prove this season before there's any more talk on this front.

So I suggest Davis focus on 2019 and FCS for now. I truly believe he could turn into a top 10 FCS QB ... if the planets align, maybe top 5 FCS QB. And one good FCS season will not do it for NFL scouts.

Has any one (Pantagraph or elsewhere) asked about Davis?

Last I saw was his interview on the Bizon network where he was talking about, "going out with a bang," and is listed as a junior on our roster, despite having another year of eligibility. Any updates on that front?

 

[normalbird]

TR-as always, much meat in your observations.

As far as TE’s, I’d like to see Gillum (87) have a breakout year. He can really fly downfield for a man of his size.

It comes back to Davis and his ability to make accurate throws over the middle and short passes in the flats.

I don’t have any “inside” information, but can’t help but wonder if Davis is playing more for the name on the back of the jersey than the name on the front.

 

[Chi-bird]

Got to keep this real ... This talk about Davis considering FBS or NFL for his 5th year would probably shock the rest of MVFC teams who played him last year. I hope that's just a silly rumor with zero basis in truth. Because Davis has a lot to prove this season before there's any more talk on this front.

So I suggest Davis focus on 2019 and FCS for now. I truly believe he could turn into a top 10 FCS QB ... if the planets align, maybe top 5 FCS QB. And one good FCS season will not do it for NFL scouts.

In order to become drafted, Carson Wentz left NDSU to go to.... oh never mind......no he didn’t.

 

[fourthandshort]

TR-as always, much meat in your observations.

As far as TE’s, I’d like to see Gillum (87) have a breakout year. He can really fly downfield for a man of his size.

It comes back to Davis and his ability to make accurate throws over the middle and short passes in the flats.

I don’t have any “inside” information, but can’t help but wonder if Davis is playing more for the name on the back of the jersey than the name on the front.

I don't think we know where these ideas or rumors are coming from, so I am not going to single out Davis .. we just don't know who started these rumors, much less if they are true.

But he did add to the confusion with a couple comments he has made ... maybe inadvertently, maybe not ..... 1) the interview where he never corrected the discussion about this being his "last" year, well after he had been granted a 6th year by NCAA, and 2) in other reported comment, in context of 2019 season, about him wanting to "go out with a bang".

If it never gets clarified, then yeah .. it makes a reasonable person wonder.

If there's no truth to it, then it is rather easy question and answer. If there is truth to it, than it becomes a much tougher question and answer. And if so, it might impact how Spack handles his QB depth chart this season .. both in practice and possibly games. We've got 2 completely unproven QBs waiting in wings .. a RS FR and a true FR.

Randy .. time to ask the obvious question. Tough being a local reporter not wanting to stir up any trouble ... but we're supposed to have a free press, right ?

 

[NewBird]

A junior eligibility wise, Davis will have enough credits to graduate after the fall semester. He said he will decide after the season if he will return to ISU in 2020.
“I really want to play to the top of my potential this year and see where that takes me,” Davis said. “It’s fair to call me a junior when it comes to football, but I’ve been in college a long time. It’s a blessing to have that extra year, and I will definitely utilize it if need be.”

From an August 2nd Pantagraph article. He did miss two seasons with a torn ACL. That may be on his mind a little bit. I think he is one hundred percent Redbird and loves this team.

 

[Total Red]

As far as TE’s, I’d like to see Gillum (87) have a breakout year. He can really fly downfield for a man of his size.

:text-+1: I remember a punt return at North Dakota St. last season where Gillum covered a lot of turf to catch a speedy NDSU player.

 

[TIMMY]

This year is this year. The time to worry about Davis 2020 is 2020.
I love the comment on Gillium. If he can stretch the middle of the field and beat Cover 2 it will be huge for the offense. This team needs to run the ball. To do that well you have to keep safeties honest and keep 8 out of the box. The tight end is so important.
I don’t think this is a 4 quick team. Gillum and McCoyn are too good to be standing over by Spack. There’s a talent drop with the 3rd and 4th receivers compared to those two. Yes 4 quick will have it’s time and place. But to do that you really need to run read option and to my surprise last year Davis didn’t show much of a running treat. If he can’t hold the option man and it’s not much of a play. He’s not Roberson. And you can stack the box just as easily against 4 wide receivers sets as you can against 2 and 3 receiver sets.
Play action helps a heavy handed O line. You gotta help those fat kids by keeping the D line honest. Don’t let the defense tee off. Show some run when you’re throwing and run some draws and screens in passing situations to make those guys hold their water. Proctor should excel at both.
I think the defense will be awesome. If the offense can stay away from 3 and outs the defense can carry this team a long way.
Robinson at this point is a wily veteran. Keep him healthy. It’s still summer.

 

[fourthandshort]

This year is this year. The time to worry about Davis 2020 is 2020.
I love the comment on Gillium. If he can stretch the middle of the field and beat Cover 2 it will be huge for the offense. This team needs to run the ball. To do that well you have to keep safeties honest and keep 8 out of the box. The tight end is so important.
I don’t think this is a 4 quick team. Gillum and McCoyn are too good to be standing over by Spack. There’s a talent drop with the 3rd and 4th receivers compared to those two. Yes 4 quick will have it’s time and place. But to do that you really need to run read option and to my surprise last year Davis didn’t show much of a running treat. If he can’t hold the option man and it’s not much of a play. He’s not Roberson. And you can stack the box just as easily against 4 wide receivers sets as you can against 2 and 3 receiver sets.
Play action helps a heavy handed O line. You gotta help those fat kids by keeping the D line honest. Don’t let the defense tee off. Show some run when you’re throwing and run some draws and screens in passing situations to make those guys hold their water. Proctor should excel at both.
I think the defense will be awesome. If the offense can stay away from 3 and outs the defense can carry this team a long way.
Robinson at this point is a wily veteran. Keep him healthy. It’s still summer.

We were last place in MVFC in 3rd down conversion rate ... if we fix short pass game, we will fix that stat ... and Robinson and Proctor will tear it up well into playoffs.

 

[TIMMY]

My conversion rate on 3rd and 1 was 88% It dropped to 35% on 3rd and 7. So 3rd down conversion rate is a nice stat. But creating a manageable 2nd down and a manageable 3rd down is more important.