Playoffs? PLAYOFFS?! We're talking about PLAYOFFS?!

fourthandshort

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Fun to go back and look - I checked the season predictions thread, and was surprised at how few brave souls made a prediction (I was one of the scaredy cats). But actually, 7-4 was a popular choice. By those willing to make a prediction.

8-3: one vote
7-4: 3 votes, with all of the 6-5 predictors saying 7-4 was a good possibility
6-5: 3 votes
5-6: 2 votes

So actually 7-4 was expected by some on the board.
You forgot I had 2 picks .. one was rounded up to nearest integer as a fan ... 7-4. One was not, as I ran it thru my win patent-pending probability calculator. And that came up right at 6.5 wins and 4.5 losses.

In conclusion, I think most will agree that I win either way at 6-5 or 7-4.

1666126643495.png
 

fourthandshort

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Since the loss in the 2014 Championship game Spack is 3-3 in playoff games.
Finished above .500 in MVFC games once in the last six seasons (19-25) A loss Saturday at Indiana State would likely make it one finish above .500 in the last seven seasons.
2015 MVFC 7-1 Playoffs 1-1
2016 MVFC 4-4 Playoffs 0-1
2017 MVFC 4-4 No Playoffs
2018 MVFC 3-5 No Playoffs
2019 MVFC 5-3 Playoffs 2-1
2020 MVFC 1-3 No Playoffs
2021 MVFC 2-6 No Playoffs
2022 MVFC 2-1 (currently)

Is this a resume closer to:
A. a field named after you
B. being fired

C. not getting a contract renewal in 2025

FIFY from rhetorical to actual question ... my answer is C.

Assuming 2022-24 doesn't see some level of collective success, then yes, Spack not getting his contract renewed in 2025 should be a definite consideration. How we determine Collective success is a grey area for sure, but I would think following:

- 2 or 3 playoff appearances means his contract gets renewed
- 1 means were strongly considering options
- 0 means we're already looking for new HC his last season.

By the way .. he is still the best football coach we've ever had by far .. so may it's A and C.

Question back though .. if next coach hired does worse, do we fire the AD next for not leaving pretty good alone ?
 

MadBird

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You forgot I had 2 picks .. one was rounded up to nearest integer as a fan ... 7-4. One was not, as I ran it thru my win patent-pending probability calculator. And that came up right at 6.5 wins and 4.5 losses.

In conclusion, I think most will agree that I win either way at 6-5 or 7-4.

View attachment 819
So, there were 3 folks who said 7-4, and then also the three 6-5 folks said 7-4 was a possibility
 

RedbirdSoxFan

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FIFY from rhetorical to actual question ... my answer is C.

Assuming 2022-24 doesn't see some level of collective success, then yes, Spack not getting his contract renewed in 2025 should be a definite consideration. How we determine Collective success is a grey area for sure, but I would think following:

- 2 or 3 playoff appearances means his contract gets renewed
- 1 means were strongly considering options
- 0 means we're already looking for new HC his last season.

By the way .. he is still the best football coach we've ever had by far .. so may it's A and C.

Question back though .. if next coach hired does worse, do we fire the AD next for not leaving pretty good alone ?
Aside from Todd Berry, the bar wasn’t set very high to become the “best football coach we’ve ever had”. I doubt that every head coach that took his team to the National Championship game has had his school football field named after him. I would think more have been fired after following up with years of mediocrity and failure.
 

fourthandshort

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Aside from Todd Berry, the bar wasn’t set very high to become the “best football coach we’ve ever had”. I doubt that every head coach that took his team to the National Championship game has had his school football field named after him. I would think more have been fired after following up with years of mediocrity and failure.
I was mostly, ok, entirely kidding ... although, Howard Hancock's college coaching record was 57-46-19. I believe he is best known for setting the college record for ties.

And I think he got a football stadium named after him somewhere .... :unsure: ;) 😁
 

Virginia Redbird

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With this schedule they have, I always thought the Southern game was going to be the deciding factor for the Birds. Win that game and it is a different season. It would have been a win that was impacting. The boys can still make the playoffs but unless they beat either NDSU or SDSU really none of the rest of the games on the schedule are all that impacting as W's. UNI is the biggest victory to date and they are currently 3-4, 2-2 in the MVFC. If the Birds should upset either NDSU or SDSU then it is a whole different discussion but I just don't see that happening, especially with both games on the road. That first half against Southern really hurt this team's chances for the postseason.
 

Cheesehead

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Agreed, have to pull an upset over one of the Dakota States and not slip up in any of the of the other three games. The southern Illinois no PI call cost any wiggle room because we’re clearly still blackballed from pulling the plug on the COVID year.
 

Total Red

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The southern Illinois no PI call cost any wiggle room because we’re clearly still blackballed from pulling the plug on the COVID year.
Are you saying the refs didn't call PI in the SIU game because we didn't finish the spring Covid season?? Perhaps I am misunderstanding you. Can you explain it in greater detail? Exactly who is doing what and why? Thanks in advance.
 

Virginia Redbird

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Agreed, have to pull an upset over one of the Dakota States and not slip up in any of the of the other three games. The southern Illinois no PI call cost any wiggle room because we’re clearly still blackballed from pulling the plug on the COVID year.
I thought it was a missed call on the no-interference call too. Having said that though, I don't think that cost the Redbirds the Southern game. Not showing up for the entire first half is what cost them the game. It should never have come down to last-minute attempts into the end zone in that game. The blame should be put where it really is deserved and you can't sleepwalk through an entire half of football and most times expect to win.
 

Redbird28

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Are you saying the refs didn't call PI in the SIU game because we didn't finish the spring Covid season?? Perhaps I am misunderstanding you. Can you explain it in greater detail? Exactly who is doing what and why? Thanks in advance.
I think he's making 2 different statements. 1) The PI that didn't get called cost us our wiggle room in making the playoffs this year. 2) We're not currently in the playoff discussion because we are being blackballed due to pulling out during the COVID year.

Perhaps my translation skills are a little off, but I think that's what he is saying anyway.
 

Cheesehead

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I think he's making 2 different statements. 1) The PI that didn't get called cost us our wiggle room in making the playoffs this year. 2) We're not currently in the playoff discussion because we are being blackballed due to pulling out during the COVID year.

Perhaps my translation skills are a little off, but I think that's what he is saying anyway.
Exactly, thanks. SIU game cost us needed wiggle room, should have played better first half absolutely. I think we would/are being viewed unfavorably so can’t afford to be borderline
 

Total Red

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Exactly, thanks. SIU game cost us needed wiggle room, should have played better first half absolutely. I think we would/are being viewed unfavorably so can’t afford to be borderline
Ok. I get what you are saying but I would be surprised if the selection committee would go back to the 2021 winter/spring season and punish us for not finishing out the last 4 games. If they do feel that way, then Indiana St. never stood a chance because they cancelled the entire 2021 spring without playing a game.

What didn't add up for me was the explanation that we cancelled the back half of the 2021 spring season due to concerns over player safety. In particular we had injuries on the defensive line. But if you look at the final game of the 2021 spring we rotated 5 D-linemen at the 3 down line positions. Nobody had to play the whole game and even though John Ridgeway was supposedly our best D-Lineman he didn't come close to playing every defensive down.

It seems to me that if player safety was an issue you would have gone the route of Indiana St. and cancelled the entire 2021 spring season. By agreeing to play in the spring you were asking your players to play a potential 27 games in one calendar year when you come back and play again in the fall. Let's count 'em up. We had an 8 game regular season scheduled in spring '21. If you make the playoffs that could be an additional 4 games. Then you come back in the fall '21 for an 11 game regular season plus a potential 4 playoff games in the fall of '21. The '21 spring playoffs had only 16 teams, so only 4 potential games. The '21 fall playoffs were back to 24 teams with a potential 5 playoff games for some teams, but only 4 are in the calendar year of 2021. The championship was played Jan '22.

So 2021 spring 8+4 and 2021 fall 11+4 equals 27. One team, South Dakota St., did play the maximum number of playoff games (8) in 2021. 27 games in one calendar year are way too many. Nobody played that many (South Dakota St. played 25 total) due to cancellations by teams like us, but nobody knew about that at the time the schedule was set. I was stunned that so many college coaches would agree to put their players through that many games in a calendar year and if they did agree I have a hard time believing them if they come back later and say that they cancelled the season due to safety concerns. The last game we played in the spring of '21 was Western, the easiest game on the schedule.
 

Redbirdwarrior

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I'm interested to hear what you guys expect out of our football program.

Do you expect North Dakota State levels of winning? Multiple national titles and such coming to Normal? That won't happen because, unlike NDST, we are not one of 3 college football programs within 700 miles. We have to compete for recruits with not only the rest of our conference, but also the entire Big Ten, some of the ACC, some of the Big East and even some of the Big 12. We don't get the luxury of saying "If you want your parents to watch you play a game, we are the only school they can get to to do that".

You know what I expect out of ISU's football team: FCS Relevancy. There are 125 FCS teams in this country and I want our team to be considered in the top quarter of those every year.

You point out the MVFC recent record being ...meh without noting that the MVFC is effectively the SEC of FCS where every single year 3-4 of the toughest teams in the country are on your schedule.

Dude has been here 13 years. He is 96-63 in that time with multiple conference championships, a national championship game, 7 playoff wins and 8 NFL players. By winning percentage and wins, he is about exactly the same as Howard Hancock and we named a stadium after that guy.

When I stepped foot on campus in 2003, I told my dad (an ISU Alum) I was going to go to the football game that Saturday and couldn't come home. He replied "We still have a football team?". Denver did little boost that perception, but then Brock Spack shows up and proceeds to go 56-27 over his first 7 years, winning two MVFC titles in the process. Since then, he has STILL been over .500 even with the bad 2020 half season and last year's full rebuild with no QB year. He has taken this team into 3 FBS houses and been paid hefty sums to hand them a loss.

Fire this guy? Maybe you guys don't realize how hard finding a coach that can consistently win is. Since 1909, 5 years before World War 1 (113 years), Illinois State has had only two coaches with a winning record: Hancock and Spack.
 
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Virginia Redbird

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I'm interested to hear what you guys expect out of our football program.

Do you expect North Dakota State levels of winning? Multiple national titles and such coming to Normal? That won't happen because, unlike NDST, we are not one of 3 college football programs within 700 miles. We have to compete for recruits with not only the rest of our conference, but also the entire Big Ten, some of the ACC, some of the Big East and even some of the Big 12. We don't get the luxury of saying "If you want your parents to watch you play a game, we are the only school they can get to to do that".

You know what I expect out of ISU's football team: FCS Relevancy. There are 125 FCS teams in this country and I want our team to be considered in the top quarter of those every year.

You point out the MVFC recent record being ...meh without noting that the MVFC is effectively the SEC of FCS where every single year 3-4 of the toughest teams in the country are on your schedule.

Dude has been here 13 years. He is 96-63 in that time with multiple conference championships, a national championship game, 7 playoff wins and 8 NFL players. By willing percentage and wins, he is about exactly the same as Howard Hancock and we named a stadium after that guy.

When I stepped foot on campus in 2003, I told my dad (an ISU Alum) I was going to go to the football game that Saturday and couldn't come home. He replied "We still have a football team?". Denver did little boost that perception, but then Brock Spack shows up and proceeds to go 56-27 over his first 7 years, winning two MVFC titles in the process. Since then, he has STILL been over .500 even with the bad 2020 half season and last year's full rebuild with no QB year. He has taken this team into 3 FBS houses and been paid hefty sums to hand them a loss.

Fire this guy? Maybe you guys don't realize how hard finding a coach that can consistently win is. Since 1909, 5 years before World War 1 (113 years), Illinois State has had only two coaches with a winning record: Hancock and Spack.
I don't think anyone, with any sense of reality, would expect NDSU-type success. The consistent excellence that their program has had is unprecedented. I think consistent success in the nature of winning records and playoff appearances is not an unreasonable expectation for ISU. Programs have reputations and that affects recruiting. If I was a defensive player I would be very interested in attending ISU if offered. The consistency of excellent defensive play put on the field by Spack over his tenure is truly impressive. Even in years when we don't expect much due to graduation and portal transfers, he seems to find a way to put out a very good defense. If you look at the offensive side of the ball it is not the same story. I am not saying there has not been good offense under Spack (Tre and Brown always come up). But the offensive side has been more inconsistent and Spack's choices for assistant coaches have not always worked out (Both co-coordinator experiments that literally blew up in his face). That has been Spack's Achilles heel in my estimation, offense. I like the new O-Coordinator's offense and if they can keep him the team will be more balanced. Not just relying on the defense to keep the team in the game while the offense takes a half off or implodes putting the defense backs against the wall.
There are comments made repeatedly on this board about the difficulty of playing in the MVFC. I totally agree with that since the MVFC has been the premier and toughest conference in FCS over the past several years. But there is a huge advantage to playing in the MVFC. You don't have to win the conference to get a playoff bid. You don't even have to be the top 2 or 3 teams in the conference to get a playoff bid some years. Instead of playing for one playoff spot by being the conference champion, as some schools have to do, ISU has multiple opportunities to be selected for a bid because they are in the MVFC. Glass half full or half empty?
 

Total Red

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Do you expect North Dakota State levels of winning? Multiple national titles and such coming to Normal? That won't happen because, unlike NDST, we are not one of 3 college football programs within 700 miles. We have to compete for recruits with not only the rest of our conference, but also the entire Big Ten, some of the ACC, some of the Big East and even some of the Big 12. We don't get the luxury of saying "If you want your parents to watch you play a game, we are the only school they can get to to do that".
True but this is a double-edged sword and one edge is decidedly in our favor. We do have to compete with a lot of other schools for recruits but it's also true that we have a lot more potential D-I football players in our general area to start with. North Dakota is not highly populated. They have to go all the way to Minneapolis-St. Paul to find a metro area to recruit. We have Chicago, St. Louis and Indianapolis that are all closer to us than Minneapolis is to them. Of course every northern school tries to pick up some skill players in Calif, Tex and Fla. If you think those recruits are turned off by spending the winter in Central IL, just try spending the winter in Fargo.
 

redbirds2000

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FIFY from rhetorical to actual question ... my answer is C.

Assuming 2022-24 doesn't see some level of collective success, then yes, Spack not getting his contract renewed in 2025 should be a definite consideration. How we determine Collective success is a grey area for sure, but I would think following:

- 2 or 3 playoff appearances means his contract gets renewed
- 1 means were strongly considering options
- 0 means we're already looking for new HC his last season.

By the way .. he is still the best football coach we've ever had by far .. so may it's A and C.

Question back though .. if next coach hired does worse, do we fire the AD next for not leaving pretty good alone ?
Spack will retire at the end of this contract is my guess. The AD's tenure is 100% reliant on the success of Bball. If Pedon makes it to the NCAA tournament, Coach Whoever could go 3-8 in football and no one would care. If Pedon makes the NCAA, the AD will move on to bigger and better. No way he is here for the long term.
 

fourthandshort

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Spack will retire at the end of this contract is my guess. The AD's tenure is 100% reliant on the success of Bball. If Pedon makes it to the NCAA tournament, Coach Whoever could go 3-8 in football and no one would care. If Pedon makes the NCAA, the AD will move on to bigger and better. No way he is here for the long term.

Agree on good possibility Spack could retire after this contract, unless ... fill in the blank !!!

As for the rest, I wouldn't go that far. Spack has raised the bar for Fall Football being respectable and competitive. I know this is a basketball school that is currently struggling with mostly bad basketball and mostly good football over the last decade. But the expectation should now be for both to be competitive and respected on a national level for its peer programs.

Any AD that decided to let football slip to distant 2nd .. or worse .. should be fired. They've invested a fair amount in football since bringing Spack on in 2009: Hancock 2.0 in 2013, Jumbotron in 2014, the Turf in 2018, the IPF in 2023 .. all smart prudent investments, but investments nonetheless.

The bar has been raised on Redbird Football by Spack and ISU AD/Admin .. there is no going back. It wouldn't make sense.
 

fourthandshort

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Back on thread topic .. please bare with my post here about our current rankings vs where we will be come regular season end and FCS playoff selection committee time.

AGS has a panel of Top 25 voters that I believe generally does the best job of ranking FCS teams - I'll explain shortly. The Coaches and STATS polls tend to be the most followed. But are also well known to be very regionalized with conference favoritism happening a lot. Plus noone is ever held accountable for conference homerism on the Coaches and STATS polls; plus they are generally lazy and don't do much research, nor are their votes scrutinized ever.

But with AGS's Top 25 FCS panel, they are held accountable explicitly by the moderators, and then thru total forum transparency. The voters picks each week are posted on the weekly Top 25 thread after each set of weekend games. So these votes are subjected to live immediate scrutiny. They will light up voters up for dumb picks and homer picks. Regular homers eventually get kicked off the panel. New panel members are made very aware of expectations and the scrutiny. By end of regular season, AGS is always the closest to getting it right based on playoff performance.

That said, right now, AGS Top Panel currently has us ranked t-31st. if we go 3-2 the rest of way and play NDSU or SDSU respectably, we will continue to climb. Why ? because AGS voters know what it means to finish 7-4 / 5-3 in the MVFC or Big Sky, versus all other conferences. And the playoff results fully support this thinking.

As for ISU not being ranked higher by Coaches or STATS polls ... do you think a national Coaches Poll with more than half the schools being out east, are paying attention to our season ? Or anything outside their schedule or conference for that matter ? No, and many vote based on their biased belief their conference is better than what anyone else thinks, plus it helps them look better if their conference teams are ranked higher. Then add in zero transparency/scrutiny over their votes ... well, you get what you paid for with Coaches and STATS Polls.

As for computerized rankings, studies show the database of game W-L outcomes, scores, home/away, SOS, etc doesn't become "statistically well connected" until about week 6 or 7 (bye weeks for some). Computers of course must also weigh in prior season early on, until current season has sufficient credibility to lean much less on prior season as we get to weeks 6-7 & beyond. Its also when most teams have played at least 3 OOC and 3 conf games .. so a pretty good representative sampling. Right now Massey has us 24th, Sagarin has us 25th.

But the one I like the most is the Massey Composite of 33 polls/ranking sites .. a combination of a bunch of computer rankings, plus subjective rankings like AGS, Coaches, STATS, etc, Right now, Massey Composite has us 30th. It too will continue to climb our ranking if we go just 3-2, especially if we are competitive in a game against NDSU or SDSU. Coaches Poll has us 37th, STATS Poll has us 34th.

So right now, the best indicator of where we are at today, suggests about #30. And we will rightly climb into Top 20 if we go just 3-2 .. the quality and scores of those games will determine how high and fast we climb. IMO, in the end, AGS is most likely to get it closest and most objectively right.

Now let's beat ISUb decisively, and start our climb to a playoff bid. If we beat them on road by more than the last 3 teams, all the computers will know this instantly. So will the AGS Top 25 panel. Most of the Coaches and STATS poll members will only see we beat some 1-5 team, if even that.

Massey Composite of 33 rankings: College Football Ranking Composite


10/17/2022 AGS Poll Results


Rank​
Team:​
Total Points​
First Place Votes​
1​
South Dakota State Jackrabbits
1264​
42​
2​
Sac State Hornets
1213​
9​
3​
Weber State Wildcats
1133​
4​
Montana State Bobcats
1125​
5​
North Dakota State Bison
1087​
6​
Holy Cross Crusaders
964​
7​
Incarnate Word Cardinals
921​
8​
Montana Grizzlies
854​
9​
Mercer Bears
833​
10​
Chattanooga Mocs
795​
11​
William & Mary Tribe
759​
12​
Delaware Fightin' Blue Hens
712​
13​
Samford Bulldogs
639​
14​
Southern Illinois Salukis
544​
15​
Jackson State Tigers
464​
16​
Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
460​
17​
Southeast Missouri State Redhawks
458​
18​
Idaho Vandals
442​
19​
North Dakota Fighting Hawks
372​
20​
Richmond Spiders
355​
21​
Elon Phoenix
300​
22​
Rhode Island Rams
254​
23​
Fordham Rams
157​
24​
Furman Paladins
149​
25​
Southeastern Louisiana Lions
92​
ORV:
26​
Princeton Tigers
60​
27​
Austin Peay Governors
51​
28​
New Hampshire Wildcats
45​
29T​
Campbell Fighting Camels
16​
29T​
Missouri State Bears
16​
31T​
Illinois State Redbirds
14​
31T​
Villanova Wildcats
14​
33​
Stephen F. Austin Lumberjacks
8​
34​
North Carolina Central Eagles
3​
35T​
Eastern Kentucky Colonels
1​
35T​
Pennsylvania Quakers
1​
 
Last edited:

normalbird

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Back on thread topic .. please bare with my post here about our current rankings vs where we will be come regular season end and FCS playoff selection committee time.

AGS has a panel of Top 25 voters that I believe generally does the best job of ranking FCS teams - I'll explain shortly. The Coaches and STATS polls tend to be the most followed. But are also well known to be very regionalized with conference favoritism happening a lot. Plus noone is ever held accountable for conference homerism on the Coaches and STATS polls; plus they are generally lazy and don't do much research, nor are their votes scrutinized ever.

But with AGS's Top 25 FCS panel, they are held accountable explicitly by the moderators, and then thru total forum transparency. The voters picks each week are posted on the weekly Top 25 thread after each set of weekend games. So these votes are subjected to live immediate scrutiny. They will light up voters up for dumb picks and homer picks. Regular homers eventually get kicked off the panel. New panel members are made very aware of expectations and the scrutiny. By end of regular season, AGS is always the closest to getting it right based on playoff performance.

That said, right now, AGS Top Panel currently has us ranked t-31st. if we go 3-2 the rest of way and play NDSU or SDSU respectably, we will continue to climb. Why ? because AGS voters know what it means to finish 7-4 / 5-3 in the MVFC or Big Sky, versus all other conferences. And the playoff results fully support this thinking.

As for ISU not being ranked higher by Coaches or STATS polls ... do you think a national Coaches Poll with more than half the schools being out east, are paying attention to our season ? Or anything outside their schedule or conference for that matter ? No, and many vote based on their biased belief their conference is better than what anyone else thinks, plus it helps them look better if their conference teams are ranked higher. Then add in zero transparency/scrutiny over their votes ... well, you get what you paid for with Coaches and STATS Polls.

As for computerized rankings, studies show the database of game W-L outcomes, scores, home/away, SOS, etc doesn't become "statistically well connected" until about week 6 or 7 (bye weeks for some). Computers of course must also weigh in prior season early on, until current season has sufficient credibility to lean much less on prior season as we get to weeks 6-7 & beyond. Its also when most teams have played at least 3 OOC and 3 conf games .. so a pretty good representative sampling. Right now Massey has us 24th, Sagarin has us 25th.

But the one I like the most is the Massey Composite of 33 polls/ranking sites .. a combination of a bunch of computer rankings, plus subjective rankings like AGS, Coaches, STATS, etc, Right now, Massey Composite has us 30th. It too will continue to climb our ranking if we go just 3-2, especially if we are competitive in a game against NDSU or SDSU. Coaches Poll has us 37th, STATS Poll has us 34th.

So right now, the best indicator of where we are at today, suggests about #30. And we will rightly climb into Top 20 if we go just 3-2 .. the quality and scores of those games will determine how high and fast we climb. IMO, in the end, AGS is most likely to get it closest and most objectively right.

Now let's beat ISUb decisively, and start our climb to a playoff bid. If we beat them on road by more than the last 3 teams, all the computers will know this instantly. So will the AGS Top 25 panel. Most of the Coaches and STATS poll members will only see we beat some 1-5 team, if even that.

Massey Composite of 33 rankings: College Football Ranking Composite


10/17/2022 AGS Poll Results


Rank​
Team:​
Total Points​
First Place Votes​
1​
South Dakota State Jackrabbits
1264​
42​
2​
Sac State Hornets
1213​
9​
3​
Weber State Wildcats
1133​
4​
Montana State Bobcats
1125​
5​
North Dakota State Bison
1087​
6​
Holy Cross Crusaders
964​
7​
Incarnate Word Cardinals
921​
8​
Montana Grizzlies
854​
9​
Mercer Bears
833​
10​
Chattanooga Mocs
795​
11​
William & Mary Tribe
759​
12​
Delaware Fightin' Blue Hens
712​
13​
Samford Bulldogs
639​
14​
Southern Illinois Salukis
544​
15​
Jackson State Tigers
464​
16​
Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
460​
17​
Southeast Missouri State Redhawks
458​
18​
Idaho Vandals
442​
19​
North Dakota Fighting Hawks
372​
20​
Richmond Spiders
355​
21​
Elon Phoenix
300​
22​
Rhode Island Rams
254​
23​
Fordham Rams
157​
24​
Furman Paladins
149​
25​
Southeastern Louisiana Lions
92​
ORV:
26​
Princeton Tigers
60​
27​
Austin Peay Governors
51​
28​
New Hampshire Wildcats
45​
29T​
Campbell Fighting Camels
16​
29T​
Missouri State Bears
16​
31T​
Illinois State Redbirds
14​
31T​
Villanova Wildcats
14​
33​
Stephen F. Austin Lumberjacks
8​
34​
North Carolina Central Eagles
3​
35T​
Eastern Kentucky Colonels
1​
35T​
Pennsylvania Quakers
1​
Dead on re Massey Composite! There is clearly an Ivy League homer, a Colonial homer, etc. Putting them alongside the more objective rankings (SAG, MAS, AGS, etc) shows them up pretty quickly—just look for the aberrant red or blue numbers.
I am no expert, but having the opportunity to read the insights of those who know what they are talking about (no sarcasm intended) really adds to my fandom. You know who you are! Thanks.
 
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