Next year’s Non-conference schedule

Phantom

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DWRedbird said:
jamminjamarsmiley said:
I know Elgin took away the Jank tiebreakers (sort of, the NET still looks at SOS).... But, it may be time to implement something that would encourage tougher schedules. Although UNI did play in a quality MTE and at Colorado... I would be fine with their schedule if they played a couple of other mid majors and got rid of the non d-1.

I definitely think it is time to implement something that would at least encourage teams not to schedule non-D1 opponents. A couple of good mid-majors this year improve UNI's chance at an at large this year.
ISU86 said:
Missouri State was only Valley school to be non-DI free. Bradley, Evansville, Illinois State, Indiana State, Loyola Chicago, Southern Illinois and Valparaiso all scheduled one, with Drake and Northern Iowa having two.

There is no guarantee, with the additional slots, does not mean they would go after, or be able to get, quality opposition. I would think they have a minimum number of home games they prefer to hold. They could just as easily have scheduled the likes of Kennesaw State and Chicago State.

The P5+BE are generally avoiding buying the likes of the MVC. They prefer to pound on the MEAC and SWAC, then throw in a MTE and a conference challenge for good measure, then increase the number of conference games. So that means targeting the likes of AAC, A10 and MWC schools, or find schools that routinely are playing for their conference bid (Belmont, Murray State, New Mexico State, North Dakota State, South Dakota State).

Scheduling is continuing to be more of a nightmare for the mid-majors. Difficult needle to thread. For as much grief Dan Muller has received in other areas, he has made a concerted effort to schedule tougher than the Basketball Travellers Classic days of Tim Jankovich.

I would agree that scheduling is difficult, but I'd always want to schedule a D1 opponent of any caliber than I would a D1.

I don't have a problem with Muller's scheduling over all. I'm generally pretty satisfied with it but, I've never been a fan of the non-D1 in the middle of the season as it doesn't really do anything for the team.

Precisely. Schedule a second exhibition if need be, but the non-DI game in the regular season needs to stop. I'd much rather host the SEMO's, Winston-Salem's and Nicholls State's of the world than the Quincy's & Lewis's in-season.
 

ISU86

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although they may not be resume-worthy (yet), any interest in a home/home with Iona and Rick Pitino? Rick bought Dan's 'birds into Louisville a few seasons back and it would add a little something over similar programs that visit Normal during non-con.
 

Redbird222

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Redbird222 said:
BackTheBirds said:
I know the season’s not over, but just looking ahead to next year. Anyone know of any non-conference games for next season? Seems like we ended a few H/H’s this year.

Northern Kentucky home
UTSan Antonio Home
I thought I heard UAB start H/H
Cancun Challaenge ... will play 2 of 3 ... Purdue/Clemson/Mississippi State

UAB was old news. I remember reading last year H/H was originally supposed to start this year and they delayed it
 

Red Rocker

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Dan does a really good job with scheduling.

If he wanted to start with 3-4 easy games to get the confidence rolling next year, I would be fine with that, but I generally like the tough schedule he puts together. We beat Belmont and ULAR and then the wheels came off. They both made the NCAA this year - auto bid.
 

Loyl2u

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Red Rocker said:
Dan does a really good job with scheduling.

If he wanted to start with 3-4 easy games to get the confidence rolling next year, I would be fine with that, but I generally like the tough schedule he puts together. We beat Belmont and ULAR and then the wheels came off. They both made the NCAA this year - auto bid.

So before the wheels came off-
Rey played 21 minutes in Belmont game 11 pts-4 RB/Ndiaye played 19 4pt-5rb
Rey played 27 minutes in ALR game 12 points-6 RB/Ndiaye 7min 2pt-3RB

I will NEVER understand what convinced the staff that they’d be better off playing 4 guards🤷‍♂️. As we look to be retaining entire staff from last year, I hope that this was an aberration in decision making.

I know some agreed with the decision to play the 4 guards and aren’t unhappy with Rey moving on to Tulsa. I will acknowledge that I think some of the difference with these results is the fact that the Valley is better than given credit for, but I honestly believe if the #5’s would have been given minutes with Fisher on the floor like these two games, they would have continued to improve and we’d all been happy with 14-15 points a game and 9 RB from the 5 spot and Fisher would have been freed up on both ends of the court. Now if somebody can tell me that They knew Rey was leaving at beginning of conference season, so they decided to play those seniors, even though they were losing- that would finally be something I could understand- but I haven’t heard that.

Too much time to dwell on this past season w/no baseball, spring football, etc. I’m really going to try and let it go🤐
 

jamminjamarsmiley

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cpacmel said:
https://twitter.com/thed1docket/status/1254403921117958144?s=21

Dans seat is getting warm... afraid we’re going to see more games like this. 12-19 last year ranked 271 in Ken Pom. Nice
 

Redbird222

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jamminjamarsmiley said:
cpacmel said:
https://twitter.com/thed1docket/status/1254403921117958144?s=21

Dans seat is getting warm... afraid we’re going to see more games like this. 12-19 last year ranked 271 in Ken Pom. Nice

It is also getting harder to schedule P5 and Big East teams due to change in their conference schedules in recent years. BIG 10, ACC, and SEC already expanded conference schedules to 20 games and with Connecticut joining Big East and Pac 12 adopting 20 games conference schedule it gets worse next year. I believe only the Big 12 plays an 18 game conference schedule now. You throw a 3 game tournament and 2 games for these conference challenges and there is literally 2 - 3 games they are looking to fill for out of conference games.

The NCAA is proposing a change that would allow expansion to 29 games. This may or may not help. 29 games would be allowed if you play in (2) 2 game tournaments vs 28 if you are in 3 game tournament. Would 4 P5 teams match up and leave out the other conference .... perhaps and strong possibility? Its more probable when hosting an event with 4 teams to be from those 6 congmference vs an event with 8 teams ... trying to get representation from multiple leagues.

https://www-cbssports-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/ncaa-proposing-new-scheduling-rules-for-college-basketball-next-season/amp/?amp_js_v=a3&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQIKAGwASDAAQE%3D#aoh=15879165494359&amp_ct=1587916561307&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cbssports.com%2Fcollege-basketball%2Fnews%2Fncaa-proposing-new-scheduling-rules-for-college-basketball-next-season%2F

Historically Miller has had 2- 4 games every year with Conference USA, AAC, A-10, and MWC. Throw the WCC and these conference along with the MVC generally comprise the next tier. Losing the MVC - MWC challenge hurt but MWC pairing with A10 was a double whammy since this takes away a game from both of those conferences. I believe next year we have two teams on the schedule for Confernce USA already announced but I believe it is still going to be more difficult than in the past to schedule these teams too.

COVID could be potentially playing a factor as teams for budgetary purposes play more regional games. Realistically for us that will mean more Horizon, OVC, and MAC games for home and home series due to other conference scheduling trends and perhaps COVID. You may also see schools from lower tier conferences limiting their travel and not wanting to drive to Normal for a buy game. Brian Jones indicated on his Monday with Muller interview that scheduling was difficult this year. My conclusion is all of the above is impacting ISU.

MVC could help all their teams if it could pull off an appropriate conference challenge. The right expansion could also help. I think some action will be more important than ever given the trends.
 

The Beak

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Loyl2u said:
Red Rocker said:
Dan does a really good job with scheduling.

If he wanted to start with 3-4 easy games to get the confidence rolling next year, I would be fine with that, but I generally like the tough schedule he puts together. We beat Belmont and ULAR and then the wheels came off. They both made the NCAA this year - auto bid.

So before the wheels came off-
Rey played 21 minutes in Belmont game 11 pts-4 RB/Ndiaye played 19 4pt-5rb
Rey played 27 minutes in ALR game 12 points-6 RB/Ndiaye 7min 2pt-3RB

I will NEVER understand what convinced the staff that they’d be better off playing 4 guards🤷‍♂️. As we look to be retaining entire staff from last year, I hope that this was an aberration in decision making.

I know some agreed with the decision to play the 4 guards and aren’t unhappy with Rey moving on to Tulsa. I will acknowledge that I think some of the difference with these results is the fact that the Valley is better than given credit for, but I honestly believe if the #5’s would have been given minutes with Fisher on the floor like these two games, they would have continued to improve and we’d all been happy with 14-15 points a game and 9 RB from the 5 spot and Fisher would have been freed up on both ends of the court. Now if somebody can tell me that They knew Rey was leaving at beginning of conference season, so they decided to play those seniors, even though they were losing- that would finally be something I could understand- but I haven’t heard that.

Too much time to dwell on this past season w/no baseball, spring football, etc. I’m really going to try and let it go🤐

One fan who hopes you don't let it go.

Your insightful, factual analysis has been one of the few bright spots on RBF this season. Thanks for the hard work.
 

ISU86

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Redbird222 said:
jamminjamarsmiley said:
cpacmel said:
https://twitter.com/thed1docket/status/1254403921117958144?s=21

Dans seat is getting warm... afraid we’re going to see more games like this. 12-19 last year ranked 271 in Ken Pom. Nice

It is also getting harder to schedule P5 and Big East teams due to change in their conference schedules in recent years. BIG 10, ACC, and SEC already expanded conference schedules to 20 games and with Connecticut joining Big East and Pac 12 adopting 20 games conference schedule it gets worse next year. I believe only the Big 12 plays an 18 game conference schedule now. You throw a 3 game tournament and 2 games for these conference challenges and there is literally 2 - 3 games they are looking to fill for out of conference games.

The NCAA is proposing a change that would allow expansion to 29 games. This may or may not help. 29 games would be allowed if you play in (2) 2 game tournaments vs 28 if you are in 3 game tournament. Would 4 P5 teams match up and leave out the other conference .... perhaps and strong possibility? Its more probable when hosting an event with 4 teams to be from those 6 congmference vs an event with 8 teams ... trying to get representation from multiple leagues.

https://www-cbssports-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/ncaa-proposing-new-scheduling-rules-for-college-basketball-next-season/amp/?amp_js_v=a3&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQIKAGwASDAAQE%3D#aoh=15879165494359&amp_ct=1587916561307&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cbssports.com%2Fcollege-basketball%2Fnews%2Fncaa-proposing-new-scheduling-rules-for-college-basketball-next-season%2F

Historically Miller has had 2- 4 games every year with Conference USA, AAC, A-10, and MWC. Throw the WCC and these conference along with the MVC generally comprise the next tier. Losing the MVC - MWC challenge hurt but MWC pairing with A10 was a double whammy since this takes away a game from both of those conferences. I believe next year we have two teams on the schedule for Conference USA already announced but I believe it is still going to be more difficult than in the past to schedule these teams too.

COVID could be potentially playing a factor as teams for budgetary purposes play more regional games.
Realistically for us that will mean more Horizon, OVC, and MAC games for home and home series due to other conference scheduling trends and perhaps COVID. You may also see schools from lower tier conferences limiting their travel and not wanting to drive to Normal for a buy game. Brian Jones indicated on his Monday with Muller interview that scheduling was difficult this year. My conclusion is all of the above is impacting ISU.

MVC could help all their teams if it could pull off an appropriate conference challenge. The right expansion could also help. I think some action will be more important than ever given the trends.

Good response [mention]Redbird222[/mention] ; just more of the same ol' same ol' from [mention]jamminjamarsmiley[/mention].

The way I read the article was you can play 29 games if you either do not play in OR play one two-game MTE; 28 games if you play in one three-game MTE. Lots of other things, but basically I think they are trying to somewhat get a handle on using the MTE as leverage for the scheduling of additional non-conference games. Like the year we played in Cancun but also hosted Houston Baptist and South Dakota State as "campus games".

A conference challenge would be nice in some ways, but a lot of the similar conferences are the ones the MVC schools schedule for non-conference games anyway. So you would be looking at West Coast, USA, Sun Belt, Southern or Colonial ... and I would be willing to bet the top of the WCC (Brigham Young, Gonzaga, Saint Mary's) would prefer not having to do it.
 

jamminjamarsmiley

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ISU86 said:
Redbird222 said:
jamminjamarsmiley said:
Dans seat is getting warm... afraid we’re going to see more games like this. 12-19 last year ranked 271 in Ken Pom. Nice

It is also getting harder to schedule P5 and Big East teams due to change in their conference schedules in recent years. BIG 10, ACC, and SEC already expanded conference schedules to 20 games and with Connecticut joining Big East and Pac 12 adopting 20 games conference schedule it gets worse next year. I believe only the Big 12 plays an 18 game conference schedule now. You throw a 3 game tournament and 2 games for these conference challenges and there is literally 2 - 3 games they are looking to fill for out of conference games.

The NCAA is proposing a change that would allow expansion to 29 games. This may or may not help. 29 games would be allowed if you play in (2) 2 game tournaments vs 28 if you are in 3 game tournament. Would 4 P5 teams match up and leave out the other conference .... perhaps and strong possibility? Its more probable when hosting an event with 4 teams to be from those 6 congmference vs an event with 8 teams ... trying to get representation from multiple leagues.

https://www-cbssports-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/ncaa-proposing-new-scheduling-rules-for-college-basketball-next-season/amp/?amp_js_v=a3&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQIKAGwASDAAQE%3D#aoh=15879165494359&amp_ct=1587916561307&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cbssports.com%2Fcollege-basketball%2Fnews%2Fncaa-proposing-new-scheduling-rules-for-college-basketball-next-season%2F

Historically Miller has had 2- 4 games every year with Conference USA, AAC, A-10, and MWC. Throw the WCC and these conference along with the MVC generally comprise the next tier. Losing the MVC - MWC challenge hurt but MWC pairing with A10 was a double whammy since this takes away a game from both of those conferences. I believe next year we have two teams on the schedule for Conference USA already announced but I believe it is still going to be more difficult than in the past to schedule these teams too.

COVID could be potentially playing a factor as teams for budgetary purposes play more regional games.
Realistically for us that will mean more Horizon, OVC, and MAC games for home and home series due to other conference scheduling trends and perhaps COVID. You may also see schools from lower tier conferences limiting their travel and not wanting to drive to Normal for a buy game. Brian Jones indicated on his Monday with Muller interview that scheduling was difficult this year. My conclusion is all of the above is impacting ISU.

MVC could help all their teams if it could pull off an appropriate conference challenge. The right expansion could also help. I think some action will be more important than ever given the trends.

Good response @Redbird222 ; just more of the same ol' same ol' from @jamminjamarsmiley.

The way I read the article was you can play 29 games if you either do not play in OR play one two-game MTE; 28 games if you play in one three-game MTE. Lots of other things, but basically I think they are trying to somewhat get a handle on using the MTE as leverage for the scheduling of additional non-conference games. Like the year we played in Cancun but also hosted Houston Baptist and South Dakota State as "campus games".

A conference challenge would be nice in some ways, but a lot of the similar conferences are the ones the MVC schools schedule for non-conference games anyway. So you would be looking at West Coast, USA, Sun Belt, Southern or Colonial ... and I would be willing to bet the top of the WCC (Brigham Young, Gonzaga, Saint Mary's) would prefer not having to do it.

Outside of the MTE which frankly is a few average high majors, Dans schedule next year is very weak.
 

Redbird60451

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jamminjamarsmiley said:
ISU86 said:
Redbird222 said:
It is also getting harder to schedule P5 and Big East teams due to change in their conference schedules in recent years. BIG 10, ACC, and SEC already expanded conference schedules to 20 games and with Connecticut joining Big East and Pac 12 adopting 20 games conference schedule it gets worse next year. I believe only the Big 12 plays an 18 game conference schedule now. You throw a 3 game tournament and 2 games for these conference challenges and there is literally 2 - 3 games they are looking to fill for out of conference games.

The NCAA is proposing a change that would allow expansion to 29 games. This may or may not help. 29 games would be allowed if you play in (2) 2 game tournaments vs 28 if you are in 3 game tournament. Would 4 P5 teams match up and leave out the other conference .... perhaps and strong possibility? Its more probable when hosting an event with 4 teams to be from those 6 congmference vs an event with 8 teams ... trying to get representation from multiple leagues.

https://www-cbssports-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/ncaa-proposing-new-scheduling-rules-for-college-basketball-next-season/amp/?amp_js_v=a3&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQIKAGwASDAAQE%3D#aoh=15879165494359&amp_ct=1587916561307&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cbssports.com%2Fcollege-basketball%2Fnews%2Fncaa-proposing-new-scheduling-rules-for-college-basketball-next-season%2F

Historically Miller has had 2- 4 games every year with Conference USA, AAC, A-10, and MWC. Throw the WCC and these conference along with the MVC generally comprise the next tier. Losing the MVC - MWC challenge hurt but MWC pairing with A10 was a double whammy since this takes away a game from both of those conferences. I believe next year we have two teams on the schedule for Conference USA already announced but I believe it is still going to be more difficult than in the past to schedule these teams too.

COVID could be potentially playing a factor as teams for budgetary purposes play more regional games.
Realistically for us that will mean more Horizon, OVC, and MAC games for home and home series due to other conference scheduling trends and perhaps COVID. You may also see schools from lower tier conferences limiting their travel and not wanting to drive to Normal for a buy game. Brian Jones indicated on his Monday with Muller interview that scheduling was difficult this year. My conclusion is all of the above is impacting ISU.

MVC could help all their teams if it could pull off an appropriate conference challenge. The right expansion could also help. I think some action will be more important than ever given the trends.

Good response @Redbird222 ; just more of the same ol' same ol' from @jamminjamarsmiley.

The way I read the article was you can play 29 games if you either do not play in OR play one two-game MTE; 28 games if you play in one three-game MTE. Lots of other things, but basically I think they are trying to somewhat get a handle on using the MTE as leverage for the scheduling of additional non-conference games. Like the year we played in Cancun but also hosted Houston Baptist and South Dakota State as "campus games".

A conference challenge would be nice in some ways, but a lot of the similar conferences are the ones the MVC schools schedule for non-conference games anyway. So you would be looking at West Coast, USA, Sun Belt, Southern or Colonial ... and I would be willing to bet the top of the WCC (Brigham Young, Gonzaga, Saint Mary's) would prefer not having to do it.

Outside of the MTE which frankly is a few average high majors, Dans schedule next year is very weak.

I think this is a great get. Its only an hour and a half or so away from Chicago, so many can travel to an away game. It's probably not expensive to get tickets, it's in the heart of downtown Milwaukee ON A SATURDAY NIGHT. Team travel is not expensive and the team won't stay overnight, likely. Screw the NCAA ratings, those only apply if you think we are going to be an at large worthy team next year or the year after. No it's not Marquett or some sexy name. But this is going to be a winable road game, for a young inexperienced team. And it's going to be a fun location for your home fans to have an opportunity to travel too and get tickets at a non-NBA price, unlike a Kentucky or Louisville, ect...
 

ricohill

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My question is will there be MTE tournaments this year? I hope things get better, but I'm worried about travel for the teams. Could they shift the tournaments outside of the continental US back to campus or neutral sites to make them happen?

Is World Travelers still in business??
 

TIMMY

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Thanks Mel. Perhaps a little pre or post game RBF get together at a fine Milwaukee establishment? Sobelmans comes to mind. :drool:
 

SgtHulka

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TIMMY said:
Thanks Mel. Perhaps a little pre or post game RBF get together at a fine Milwaukee establishment? Sobelmans comes to mind. :drool:

He can also give you the name of a discreet no tell hotel if you are interested
 

TIMMY

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SgtHulka said:
TIMMY said:
Thanks Mel. Perhaps a little pre or post game RBF get together at a fine Milwaukee establishment? Sobelmans comes to mind. :drool:

He can also give you the name of a discreet no tell hotel if you are interested
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